Time to fire Todd Bowles

[These Are The Days]

We don't have cap space and are a partially dismantled Superbowl champion being held together by JAG's super glue and duct tape. Relax folks. We knew we weren't winning a super bowl.

$75 million in dead cap is biting our ass because we can't afford better talent

The players failing right now are draft picks. $75 million in dead cap space is not an issue for them. Bad drafting and bad player development are the likely issues.

Hall and JTS suck donkey chunks, Mauch is a rookie, Goedeke is getting better, Cancey has promise, Palmer looks like a steal. Licht can't bat 1000 every draft. Now, I agree our development can be better but some of the guys who are bad are just bad. This was never not going to be a building year. We can continue to reload next season. We have plenty of talent to keep in contention.

Sorry brother but I'm not ready to be Youngry again with some hot shot coordinator. I don't like Bowles either but the Bucs aren't losing because of defense, they're losing because the offensive line cannot block for the run game at all. We are the most one dimensional team in football

[13F11B]

If we wanted to compete this year, we needed to prioritize the offense after what we saw last year. Instead Bowles ignored the problem and prioritized his defense because he arrogantly believes his defense is good enough to carry the team to glory. Instead the defense is being wasted on a historically bad running game that could have been adresssed.

Yet more evidence that Bowles is in way over his head. He can not get value out of the defensive picks we have made and does not realize the offense is an issue.

[These Are The Days]

The players failing right now are draft picks. $75 million in dead cap space is not an issue for them. Bad drafting and bad player development are the likely issues.

I agree to a point. Three years in a row our top pick was used on the defensive front and we struggle to get pressure without blitzing. Kancey does look like a win, but JTS and Hall are massive flops.

I think the main issue is that the defense is getting most of our resources because the HC is a defensive guy. Paying Dean when were already paying Carlton and have a decaying offense was a stupid move. We traded a solid veteran offensive lineman away for nothing to get the space to overpay Dean and then just went cheap filling out the offense with Mayfield, Feiler and Edmonds.

If we wanted to compete this year, we needed to prioritize the offense after what we saw last year. Instead Bowles ignored the problem and prioritized his defense because he arrogantly believes his defense is good enough to carry the team to glory. Instead the defense is being wasted on a historically bad running game that could have been adresssed.

Tom Brady, a healthy Jensen and a not yet retired Ali Marpet affords a lot of grace. I'm not saying you're wrong or that hindsight is 20:20. I'm saying that we still have time to draft and develop more players on offense and contend. We don't know what we have in Baker. He's being asked to lead the most one dimensional team in football and not many are capable of it. Right now brother we're probably looking at some guard at Wisconsin and we'll take him 2nd round and it'll be just fine. I normally am not this optimistic but the precedent on defense was okay with me considering what we had on offense for a good few years. I seriously think one more good draft and a few good choices in free agency and the Bucs can win 11 next year. The hill in the NFC South isn't Mount Everest

But maybe time will prove you right. I don't know. I'm strangely calm right now

[Snake]

“We don't know what we have in Baker.”

You stop that shit right now. Baker Mayfield has damn near 2500 throws in the NFL.

[Bootz]

If we wanted to compete this year, we needed to prioritize the offense after what we saw last year. Instead Bowles ignored the problem and prioritized his defense because he arrogantly believes his defense is good enough to carry the team to glory. Instead the defense is being wasted on a historically bad running game that could have been adresssed.

Yet more evidence that Bowles is in way over his head. He can not get value out of the defensive picks we have made and does not realize the offense is an issue.

Him firing Leftwich and most of the offensive staff contradicts any opinion that he doesn't realize the offense is an issue. That's why Canales and company are here.

[Miller4Prez64]

Yet more evidence that Bowles is in way over his head. He can not get value out of the defensive picks we have made and does not realize the offense is an issue.

Him firing Leftwich and most of the offensive staff contradicts any opinion that he doesn't realize the offense is an issue. That's why Canales and company are here.

The problem is, their idea of fixing the offense was just scapegoating Leftwich and not actually addressing the problem. We have the same issues from last year despite the OC change. Not to say Leftwich was a good OC, but the issues ran deeper than playcalling and it’s on display for all to see this season.

[Bootz]

Him firing Leftwich and most of the offensive staff contradicts any opinion that he doesn't realize the offense is an issue. That's why Canales and company are here.

The problem is, their idea of fixing the offense was just scapegoating Leftwich and not actually addressing the problem. We have the same issues from last year despite the OC change. Not to say Leftwich was a good OC, but the issues ran deeper than playcalling and it’s on display for all to see this season.

You'll get no argument from me. I knew Leftwich was scared goated last year. He paid the ultimate price for a declining Tom Brady and a pisspoor run blocking Oline. I was no Leftwich defender, but people fooled themselves into thinking he was the sole reason for our offensive woes.

Now people want to go air raid with Baker Mayfield at the helm? Okay fam. Tell me how that works.

[Obsolete]

Is Stinnie really not as good as Feiler? He seemed like he was doing pretty decent in our SB run.

[Miller4Prez64]

Is Stinnie really not as good as Feiler? He seemed like he was doing pretty decent in our SB run.

The Super Bowl run is a very short sample size from years ago, even if it was against the best competition possible. Not to mention he tore his ACL last year and may not physically be able to perform like he did in 2020.

[Babeinbucland]

. We are the most one dimensional team in football

/thread

[bucarican]

Eric Benamy time?

[Phantom]

Eric Benamy time?

You’re silly

[Nobody]

“We don't know what we have in Baker.”

You stop that shit right now. Baker Mayfield has damn near 2500 throws in the NFL.

* Volatility of process on-script. Makes the correct read and throw less than you’d like. Right around NFL-average. Sometimes maddeningly makes the wrong read or holds the ball rather than pulling the trigger.

* Makes plays off-script via pocket escapes (often runs to run) and often big, timely ones.

* Premier deep ball, but average to below it in short and intermediate game where accuracy and ball placement is less than desired. Puts the ball in danger here too often.

* Well above league average in number of batted balls.

* League average in Big Time Throws and Turnover Worthy Plays.

* Terrible Pressure 2 Sack (P2SC%) conversion rate. Gives up too many Sacks.

* Teammates seem to respond to him. Good at the podium, on the practice field, in the locker room.

———-

That would have been what I said about him prior to week 1.

That is basically what we have except (a) the Deep game strength has been more volatile and (b) the P2SC% has been better than his historical profile.

No big mystery here. Put the whole thing together and you can win in Cleveland where you have a top 5 OL and the most efficient running game in the league to smooth out the volatility. Remove that and you’re left with a gang of volatility.

Volatile NFL QBing has won exactly one time (Favre) and that case was backstopped by incredible defense, functional to + screen and running game, special teams (when teams mattered enormously), and that volatility featured a Big Time Play % that was both historically prolific and timely.

EDIT- Sorry twice. The knucklehead in Pittsburgh won despite him with a top running game + a top 3 all time defense in the 70s. I wasn’t alive, but I’d be curious what those seasons looked like rerun with a potato under Center.

[13F11B]

OK. So, I have cooled off from the loss. I still feel Bowles should never have been promoted to HC. I still feel he should have been fired after last season. I still feel he should be fired this morning. Now the only question is does team Glazer feel the same way.

[Grahamburn]

Him firing Leftwich and most of the offensive staff contradicts any opinion that he doesn't realize the offense is an issue. That's why Canales and company are here.

The problem is, their idea of fixing the offense was just scapegoating Leftwich and not actually addressing the problem. We have the same issues from last year despite the OC change. Not to say Leftwich was a good OC, but the issues ran deeper than playcalling and it’s on display for all to see this season.

What does firing Todd Bowles accomplish in fixing any/all offensive issues?

This team needs players. You need money and/or high picks to get good players.

There is no coach that could turn this roster into a true contender.

[Bootz]

The problem is, their idea of fixing the offense was just scapegoating Leftwich and not actually addressing the problem. We have the same issues from last year despite the OC change. Not to say Leftwich was a good OC, but the issues ran deeper than playcalling and it’s on display for all to see this season.

What does firing Todd Bowles accomplish in fixing any/all offensive issues?

This team needs players. You need money and/or high picks to get good players.

There is no coach that could turn this roster into a true contender.

As much as this team needs resources to build this team, people need a new scapegoat even more.

[13F11B]

What does firing Todd Bowles accomplish in fixing any/all offensive issues?

This team needs players. You need money and/or high picks to get good players.

There is no coach that could turn this roster into a true contender.

As much as this team needs resources to build this team, people need a new scapegoat even more.

I agree the team needs resources. However, Bowles terrible defensive philosophy remains. His poor decisions with time management, poor coaching decisions (like going for it on 4th and 6 yesterday) still remain. The man is a bad HC.

[MRM]

Knee jerk much? It was a hard fought division match. Bills just lost the the 1-5 Pats. Take a deep breath.

There's a difference in losing to Bill Bellichick who's run his team into the ground versus losing to Arthur Smith with Desmond Ritter at QB who turned the ball over 3 times.

[Kona]

Never cared for Bowles as the HC. But he’ll get the rest of the year to see what happens.

[Grahamburn]

As much as this team needs resources to build this team, people need a new scapegoat even more.

I agree the team needs resources. However, Bowles terrible defensive philosophy remains. His poor decisions with time management, poor coaching decisions (like going for it on 4th and 6 yesterday) still remain. The man is a bad HC.

Your previous indictments were because he played to lose and wasn't aggressive.

[Grahamburn]

What does firing Todd Bowles accomplish in fixing any/all offensive issues?

This team needs players. You need money and/or high picks to get good players.

There is no coach that could turn this roster into a true contender.

As much as this team needs resources to build this team, people need a new scapegoat even more.

I do wonder what this offense could look like if the Hall pick in the 2022 draft was Breece instead of Logan. This RB group is leaving a lot to be desired. I know they've had some blocking issues too, but these guys just seem to run right into the backs of their linemen.

[Pirate Life]

Is Stinnie really not as good as Feiler? He seemed like he was doing pretty decent in our SB run.

Devin White seemed pretty decent during our SB run too.

[Bootz]

As much as this team needs resources to build this team, people need a new scapegoat even more.

I do wonder what this offense could look like if the Hall pick in the 2022 draft was Breece instead of Logan. This RB group is leaving a lot to be desired. I know they've had some blocking issues too, but these guys just seem to run right into the backs of their linemen.

We took the theory that you can find a RB anywhere waaaaaaayy too literally. Vaughn was already no good. Rachaad White was popular for whatever reason last year and we made him our lead back. Sean Tucker was undrafted but many convinced themselves he would have been drafted if not for his medical.

The group was underwhelming to begin with. What's happened this season only confirms that.

[13F11B]

I agree the team needs resources. However, Bowles terrible defensive philosophy remains. His poor decisions with time management, poor coaching decisions (like going for it on 4th and 6 yesterday) still remain. The man is a bad HC.

Your previous indictments were because he played to lose and wasn't aggressive.

I said I would like someone who plays to win vs playing not to lose. Going for it on 4th and 6 in the first quarter is not playing to win. it is plain stupid.

[Grahamburn]

I do wonder what this offense could look like if the Hall pick in the 2022 draft was Breece instead of Logan. This RB group is leaving a lot to be desired. I know they've had some blocking issues too, but these guys just seem to run right into the backs of their linemen.

We took the theory that you can find a RB anywhere waaaaaaayy too literally. Vaughn was already no good. Rachaad White was popular for whatever reason last year and we made him our lead back. Sean Tucker was undrafted but many convinced themselves he would have been drafted if not for his medical.

The group was underwhelming to begin with. What's happened this season only confirms that.

If you have elite QB play, an elite line, and other capable weapons you can get away with a JAG running back strategy. That's clearly not us right now.

[Grahamburn]

Your previous indictments were because he played to lose and wasn't aggressive.

I said I would like someone who plays to win vs playing not to lose. Going for it on 4th and 6 in the first quarter is not playing to win. it is plain stupid.

I didn't mind it. Too long for a FG. Too close to punt it away. Worth a shot. It didn't work out, but he has shown throughout the season so far that he'll adapt and change to a more aggressive approach.

[13F11B]

I said I would like someone who plays to win vs playing not to lose. Going for it on 4th and 6 in the first quarter is not playing to win. it is plain stupid.

I didn't mind it. Too long for a FG. Too close to punt it away. Worth a shot. It didn't work out, but he has shown throughout the season so far that he'll adapt and change to a more aggressive approach.

Too many negatives vs. positives for me to think that was anywhere near a good call.

[Miller4Prez64]

The problem is, their idea of fixing the offense was just scapegoating Leftwich and not actually addressing the problem. We have the same issues from last year despite the OC change. Not to say Leftwich was a good OC, but the issues ran deeper than playcalling and it’s on display for all to see this season.

What does firing Todd Bowles accomplish in fixing any/all offensive issues?

This team needs players. You need money and/or high picks to get good players.

There is no coach that could turn this roster into a true contender.

Yeah the team needs players on offense. Bowles made the decision to route spending away from offense to his defense this offseason. We had a historically bad run game last season and Bowles’ strategy was to trade a solid OL for nothing so he could pay his second corner. We could have tried upgrading the run game this offseason even with the cap woes. We also prioritized the defense in the draft, though I am satisfied with Kancey.

All we did was fire the OC and pick up cheap spare parts and now we are surpised Pikachu looking at this team attempting to play offense. At the end of the day, I don’t trust the offense to get what it needs while Bowles is HC because he’s going to put the defense first. Not to mention the man has 7 seasons of being a bad NFL HC now and didn’t earn our HC job the proper way. He doesn’t deserve the patience.

[Doctor]

I don't get how same people expected us to be bad are the same one's upset when we're not good.

I'm the most optomistic guy here and even I know that even if this somehow becomes a competitive offense come December, it's going to sputter a lot along the way. Heck, it will likely sputter in the playoffs. Yet reading the thread you'd think we were McCarthy and Dak on year 4 instead of first time OC and Baker in month 4.

We look like exactly what we are right now. Which is better than where many thought. We more scrappy than in sync and have more heart and harmony. But so far everyone is very much bought in and looking to round out those other spots. I don't know what more you can reasonably ask from a roster or a staff at this juncture.

[Xandtar]

We shouldn't fire Todd Bowles until the day after the season is over.

Unless you want Canales promoted to interim HC who would you have in his place?

And if you do, do you think he'd do better?

[13F11B]

We shouldn't fire Todd Bowles until the day after the season is over.

Unless you want Canales promoted to interim HC who would you have in his place?

And if you do, do you think he'd do better?

1. I would promote Tom Moore or if I wanted to be funny Sarah Evans (that way the Buccaneers could claim the world's first female head coach in the NFL)
2. Moore might do better. Evans would not.
3. Canalse being promoted would be the same as when the team promoted Raheem Morris. Stupid. Probably set the man's career back 5-10 years.

[Bootz]

Tom Moore?? Nobody told me this thread was a satire piece.

[Al Bundy]

We shouldn't fire Todd Bowles until the day after the season is over.

Unless you want Canales promoted to interim HC who would you have in his place?

And if you do, do you think he'd do better?

1. I would promote Tom Moore or if I wanted to be funny Sarah Evans (that way the Buccaneers could claim the world's first female head coach in the NFL)
2. Moore might do better. Evans would not.
3. Canalse being promoted would be the same as when the team promoted Raheem Morris. Stupid. Probably set the man's career back 5-10 years.

Which is why you let Bowels ride it out. The moment he mentions bringing Devin White back you fire him on the spot.

[Phantom]

I miss Malcolm Glazer. He know how to hire the right coach.. Tony Dungy and Jon Gruden.(we traded for him that won us a Super Bowl)

[kaimaru]

Who you gonna hire? Bill Belechik?

No. Bill is a better coach, but he is to close to the end to be worth the hire. Not Pete Carol either.

Bill is failing because he got to play GM, and can't evaluate college talent. He also rather get rid of a great play a year too early instead of a year too late. See Brady and the Garoppolo situation as an example. If he was purely a coach, I think he could bring a team back to the Super Bowl