Baker Mayfield: PAID

[Doctor]

I mean it's an easy starting point thanks to Daniel Jones. So yeah it makes sense. And pound for pound, what he's going to deliver is worth that. He's the new Kirk.

With that said, its about what you can get. And the truth is while he may have plenty of believers and some may be OCs, you still need the GM to sign off on hitching his career to you. That's a big ask. At most they are thinking he's a great bridge with upside to keep the rookie on the bench long... pretty much what happened here.

We actually like him. We believe he cam start. He knows that. So if the best Falcons or Pats deal is a Mike Evans like contract, we just got to beat that. Fairness be damned. Sucks but it's true.

I see 3/90M with maybe topping $115M with playoff incentives.

[Grahamburn]

Everytime I hear this stuff I picture Tom staring at the ground on the bench - clearly frustrated. Put the pic up youngster.

Since you asked...

I don’t get it.

[BuccaNOLEer]

If he wants $44 mil per year, he's gonna have to earn it with incentives.

I"m as big a Baker Mayfield fan as anyone, and nobody is giving him $44M per year. If that's the asking price I'm all for letting him test the market and then he can come back to us with his tail between his legs.

That's what I'm saying. Give him the opportunity to earn $44 million. Just not $44 million in base salary.

[Phantom]

[kaimaru]

I'm curious, is Minnesota just a mediocre team or is Kirk Cousins? He has done nothing in his long career to suggest it. His best season in Washington was 9-7. After we left we saw that was mostly Washington, but he has had 1 10 win and 1 13 win season in Minnesota. The last two that had 13 win seasons was Keenum ffs after Bridgewater was hurt in the second game of that season. Minnesota is one team I definitely pay no attention to

I watch all Vikings games. Kirk is very good and underrated league wide. He was playing at an MVP level last year prior to his injury. The Vikings can't block up the middle and lack talent on defense. When they won all those games before Kirk got there it was because Zimmer had that defense playing lights out. Ever since Kirk got there the defense went downhill due to age and primarily investing in offense through the draft.

Who do they have on offense that's special? I can't even name a WR or RB off the top of my head there other than Justin Jefferson. Why haven't they invested in iOL at all? That just seems like their GM is horrible

[Phantom]

yay or nay?

Mayfield has earned the right to be the Buccaneers starting QB in 2024, but ultimately it will come down to if the money works for both sides.

According to former NFL agent and current CBS Sports writer Joel Corry, Mayfield projects to land around $40 million per year in a deal similar to that of what Giants' quarterback Daniel Jones signed not too far back.


"Contract package: $160 million/four years ($40 million per year)
Overall guarantees: $122.5 million
Fully guaranteed at signing: $85 million"

The money would seemingly work for both sides in this deal and likely would be closer to what Baker and his camp are looking for rather than the Buccaneers' side of things. It was recently reported that both sides are "slowly" progressing toward a deal, but that negotiations began with each side being on the complete opposite end of the spectrum.

[acmillis]

I watch all Vikings games. Kirk is very good and underrated league wide. He was playing at an MVP level last year prior to his injury. The Vikings can't block up the middle and lack talent on defense. When they won all those games before Kirk got there it was because Zimmer had that defense playing lights out. Ever since Kirk got there the defense went downhill due to age and primarily investing in offense through the draft.

Who do they have on offense that's special? I can't even name a WR or RB off the top of my head there other than Justin Jefferson. Why haven't they invested in iOL at all? That just seems like their GM is horrible

They took a WR in the first round last year who put up almost 1k yards and had 10 TDs...

[acmillis]

yay or nay?

Mayfield has earned the right to be the Buccaneers starting QB in 2024, but ultimately it will come down to if the money works for both sides.

According to former NFL agent and current CBS Sports writer Joel Corry, Mayfield projects to land around $40 million per year in a deal similar to that of what Giants' quarterback Daniel Jones signed not too far back.


"Contract package: $160 million/four years ($40 million per year)
Overall guarantees: $122.5 million
Fully guaranteed at signing: $85 million"

The money would seemingly work for both sides in this deal and likely would be closer to what Baker and his camp are looking for rather than the Buccaneers' side of things. It was recently reported that both sides are "slowly" progressing toward a deal, but that negotiations began with each side being on the complete opposite end of the spectrum.

[Redrum]

I watch all Vikings games. Kirk is very good and underrated league wide. He was playing at an MVP level last year prior to his injury. The Vikings can't block up the middle and lack talent on defense. When they won all those games before Kirk got there it was because Zimmer had that defense playing lights out. Ever since Kirk got there the defense went downhill due to age and primarily investing in offense through the draft.

Who do they have on offense that's special? I can't even name a WR or RB off the top of my head there other than Justin Jefferson. Why haven't they invested in iOL at all? That just seems like their GM is horrible

Garret Bradbury was a 1st, Ed Ingram a 2nd, Jordan Addison a 1st, Darrisaw was a 1st, Hockenson was a 2nd and a 3rd. Also yes their GM sucks.

[CannonFire]

yay or nay?

Mayfield has earned the right to be the Buccaneers starting QB in 2024, but ultimately it will come down to if the money works for both sides.

According to former NFL agent and current CBS Sports writer Joel Corry, Mayfield projects to land around $40 million per year in a deal similar to that of what Giants' quarterback Daniel Jones signed not too far back.


"Contract package: $160 million/four years ($40 million per year)
Overall guarantees: $122.5 million
Fully guaranteed at signing: $85 million"

The money would seemingly work for both sides in this deal and likely would be closer to what Baker and his camp are looking for rather than the Buccaneers' side of things. It was recently reported that both sides are "slowly" progressing toward a deal, but that negotiations began with each side being on the complete opposite end of the spectrum.

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

[kaimaru]

yay or nay?

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

PFF has Baker at 77.2 this year which solidifies him as a quality starter not replacement level player, but keep up your hate for Mayfield

TAMPA BAY BUCCANEERS: QB BAKER MAYFIELD (77.2)
The former first-overall pick had an incredible resurgence with the Bucs, improving his PFF grade by more than 26 points over his 2022 performance. Mayfield set a career high in passing yardage (4,895), to go with 30 big-time throws, just the second time he has reached that mark in his career.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-gr ... erformance.

[Grahamburn]

yay or nay?

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

There are a lot more replacement level baseball players out there than there are starting caliber NFL quarterbacks. Terrible analogy.

A better one would be a mid-tier #1 ACE level pitcher. One of the top 15 best pitchers in the game. Those guys make more to throw an inning than most people make in a year.

[Backside]

If he does get that contract I just hope it goes better for us than Daniel Jones did for the Giants.

[acmillis]

If he does get that contract I just hope it goes better for us than Daniel Jones did for the Giants.

It wont

[Backside]

If he does get that contract I just hope it goes better for us than Daniel Jones did for the Giants.

It wont

And tonight's lotto numbers are...?

[CantonJester]

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

There are a lot more replacement level baseball players out there than there are starting caliber NFL quarterbacks. Terrible analogy.

A better one would be a mid-tier #1 ACE level pitcher. One of the top 15 best pitchers in the game. Those guys make more to throw an inning than most people make in a year.

IMO Mayfield is in the bottom quarter of starting QB upside in the NFL. You don't pay for mediocrity with the upside of average.

[GreatTimes]

There are a lot more replacement level baseball players out there than there are starting caliber NFL quarterbacks. Terrible analogy.

A better one would be a mid-tier #1 ACE level pitcher. One of the top 15 best pitchers in the game. Those guys make more to throw an inning than most people make in a year.

IMO Mayfield is in the bottom quarter of starting QB upside in the NFL. You don't pay for mediocrity with the upside of average.

Per ESPN, Baker had a QBR that ranked him as #18 in the NFL. That was while playing the 5th easiest schedule in the NFL with some pretty good WR's. I think the play that shows what type of QB baker is was in the playoff game against the Lions. The Bucs were down by 16 in the 4th QTR. The Bucs scored a TD on a Mike Evans catch. The Bucs needed a 2 point conversion. Mike Evans ran a route to the back of the endzone. The DB had his back to Baker. All Baker needed to do was throw the ball slightly above Evans head. Where did the pass go? Right into the middle of the DB's back. Short throw 2 foot lower than it needed to be. To make matter worse, if Baker had looked to his right Otton was wide open running towards Baker. At that point is was game over. The Bucs would have needed 2 scores to win. That is what you get with Baker Mayfield.

[Babeinbucland]

Damn, that looks bad. Especially when every other QB is perfect on every throw

[acmillis]

It wont

And tonight's lotto numbers are...?

It’s Thursday

[Grahamburn]

IMO Mayfield is in the bottom quarter of starting QB upside in the NFL. You don't pay for mediocrity with the upside of average.

Per ESPN, Baker had a QBR that ranked him as #18 in the NFL. That was while playing the 5th easiest schedule in the NFL with some pretty good WR's. I think the play that shows what type of QB baker is was in the playoff game against the Lions. The Bucs were down by 16 in the 4th QTR. The Bucs scored a TD on a Mike Evans catch. The Bucs needed a 2 point conversion. Mike Evans ran a route to the back of the endzone. The DB had his back to Baker. All Baker needed to do was throw the ball slightly above Evans head. Where did the pass go? Right into the middle of the DB's back. Short throw 2 foot lower than it needed to be. To make matter worse, if Baker had looked to his right Otton was wide open running towards Baker. At that point is was game over. The Bucs would have needed 2 scores to win. That is what you get with Baker Mayfield.

They were down 14. They did not need a two point conversion. It was a one score game.

It was 17-17 going into the 4th quarter. The Lions had scored touchdowns on three straight second half possessions. He was able to answer the first one. The others it didn’t work out. Blame that on Mayfield I guess? Maybe the defense could step up?

[Sdbucs]

Per PFF Baker was the #4 performing QB in the post season behind Mahomes, Stafford, Allen

He was #3 in big time throws (qb made a great play)

He was middle of the pack in turnover worthy plays. Better than Allen, Purdy, Jackson, Flacco, Hurts, and Dak.

Adjusted completion (accounts for drops, etc.) he was middle of the pack.

Pressures converted to sack - Baker was the worst of all QBs

This is similar to the full season. Baker has the big play potential and shows it. But he takes sacks often and makes questionable decisions. Can we help with these downsides?

[Grahamburn]

Per PFF Baker was the #4 performing QB in the post season behind Mahomes, Stafford, Allen

He was #3 in big time throws (qb made a great play)

He was middle of the pack in turnover worthy plays. Better than Allen, Purdy, Jackson, Flacco, Hurts, and Dak.

Adjusted completion (accounts for drops, etc.) he was middle of the pack.

Pressures converted to sack - Baker was the worst of all QBs

This is similar to the full season. Baker has the big play potential and shows it. But he takes sacks often and makes questionable decisions. Can we help with these downsides?

It would have helped to block Aidan Hutchison.

[Phantom]

Could today be the day?

[CannonFire]

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

There are a lot more replacement level baseball players out there than there are starting caliber NFL quarterbacks. Terrible analogy.

A better one would be a mid-tier #1 ACE level pitcher. One of the top 15 best pitchers in the game. Those guys make more to throw an inning than most people make in a year.

Ok, so we're in an agreement then. You just described Mitch Keller who just got a 5 year $77M deal. Let's get that deal for Baker and we're all happy, right?

[CannonFire]

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

PFF has Baker at 77.2 this year which solidifies him as a quality starter not replacement level player, but keep up your hate for Mayfield

TAMPA BAY BUCCANEERS: QB BAKER MAYFIELD (77.2)
The former first-overall pick had an incredible resurgence with the Bucs, improving his PFF grade by more than 26 points over his 2022 performance. Mayfield set a career high in passing yardage (4,895), to go with 30 big-time throws, just the second time he has reached that mark in his career.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-gr ... erformance.

Derek Carr was also graded out as a 77.2 and the consensus on this board is that Carr isn't that good. Weird, huh?

[Bootz]

Could today be the day?

No

[uscbucsfan1]

PFF has Baker at 77.2 this year which solidifies him as a quality starter not replacement level player, but keep up your hate for Mayfield



https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-gr ... erformance.

Derek Carr was also graded out as a 77.2 and the consensus on this board is that Carr isn't that good. Weird, huh?

Carr has a 4 year $150mm contract. Odd example to use.

[CannonFire]

Derek Carr was also graded out as a 77.2 and the consensus on this board is that Carr isn't that good. Weird, huh?

Carr has a 4 year $150mm contract. Odd example to use.

Not really, it's the perfect one. People seem to think that Carr isn't good. Carr is getting the deal that people are talking about Mayfield getting (actually less in some instances if you go by the Daniel Jones contract), and he got the same PFF grading. So, is Derek Carr actually good and people here are wrong about him or is Derek Carr not good and those who think Baker should be paid in kind, are foolish?

[uscbucsfan1]

Carr has a 4 year $150mm contract. Odd example to use.

Not really, it's the perfect one. People seem to think that Carr isn't good. Carr is getting the deal that people are talking about Mayfield getting (actually less in some instances if you go by the Daniel Jones contract), and he got the same PFF grading. So, is Derek Carr actually good and people here are wrong about him or is Derek Carr not good and those who think Baker should be paid in kind, are foolish?

I think the better lesson is that the market is more expensive than you realize for mid-tier QBs like Jones and Carr.

[CannonFire]

Not really, it's the perfect one. People seem to think that Carr isn't good. Carr is getting the deal that people are talking about Mayfield getting (actually less in some instances if you go by the Daniel Jones contract), and he got the same PFF grading. So, is Derek Carr actually good and people here are wrong about him or is Derek Carr not good and those who think Baker should be paid in kind, are foolish?

I think the better lesson is that the market is more expensive than you realize for mid-tier QBs like Jones and Carr.

No, I know what "the market" says... my point the whole time has been that it would be foolish for Tampa to follow that trend. Pay him what he should make, not what other teams think other players should make.

[uscbucsfan1]

I think the better lesson is that the market is more expensive than you realize for mid-tier QBs like Jones and Carr.

No, I know what "the market" says... my point the whole time has been that it would be foolish for Tampa to follow that trend. Pay him what he should make, not what other teams think other players should make.

That's not how it works...otherwise Mahomes would remain the highest paid QB in the NFL.

The market dictates salaries and that's why most new contracts are higher than before, even for players that aren't as good as previously signed ones.

If the Bucs want Mayfield, he's likely going to cost a lot of money. I get that you don't think they should go for him, but if the organization thinks he'll be the best path forward, they'll pay him a lot of money.

[Sdbucs]

Baker Mayfield is a bottom tier starter in the NFL. In baseball terms, that he would be termed a "Replacement Level Player" (RLP). You don't pay those types of players a lot of money. Anyone else who is a RLP will be able to come into Tampa and do what Mayfield can do. Mayfield took a lesser contract to be guaranteed a chance to start. I put a bottom tier RLP starting QB at around $12M AAV. That's what Mayfield should get. I'm even ok with a bit more for a "nice to have you back gesture", at a 3 yr / $45M deal. Anything more than that, is an overpay. A deal like Jones', is galactically stupid and if Licht even entertains that idea, the Glazer's should fire him on the spot.

PFF has Baker at 77.2 this year which solidifies him as a quality starter not replacement level player, but keep up your hate for Mayfield

TAMPA BAY BUCCANEERS: QB BAKER MAYFIELD (77.2)
The former first-overall pick had an incredible resurgence with the Bucs, improving his PFF grade by more than 26 points over his 2022 performance. Mayfield set a career high in passing yardage (4,895), to go with 30 big-time throws, just the second time he has reached that mark in his career.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-gr ... erformance.

77.2, the QB number #20. Out of 41 QBs. Behind Jake Browning, Geno Smith, Russell Wilson to name a few.

Turnover worthy plays - #18. So upper half of QBs making turnover worthy plays (bad)
Pressure to sack - #18. So upper half of QBs taking sacks off pressure (bad)
Batted Throws - #20. League median for batted throws.
Big Time Throws - #20. League median for great throws.

All the PFF data shows that Baker is slightly below average for QB play. In what world is that "quality starter"? You should want, you NEED your QB playing in the top quartile to win anything.

The top quartile QBs this year per PFF:
Josh Allen - Divisional Round
Patrick Mahomes - Superbowl
Lamar Jackson - AFC Championship
Dak Prescott - Wildcard
Matthew Stafford - Wild Card
Brock Purdy - Superbowl
Tua Tagovailoa - Wild Card
Jalen Hurts - Wild Card
Kirk Cousins - Injury
Jared Goff - NFC Championship

The only one to not make playoffs was Kirk, and he was out injured. 9 of the 14 playoff QBs were top quartile, including both Superbowl contenders and all championship contenders.

We need Baker to step it up, we need an elite defense, or we need a new QB. Those are our paths to winning.


The Baker data is also skewed by his playoff performance. He was even worse during the regular season.

[Backside]

I don't really care about the number being high. I'm sure people will be freaking out when it first gets announced as some insane overpay. Then eventually the real numbers will come out and it won't be as bad as it looks.

I'm definitely in favor of heavy incentives and a shorter term contract (at least in terms of guarantees). If we do that, sure, let him get some huge number his agent can brag about.

I really think trust in Licht is the most reasonable thing here. Since his first few years where he was learning by making mistakes, he has very rarely given out atrocious value contracts, or let guys get away. I feel like every time we bring back one of our own both sides always seem pretty pleased with the deal eventually.

I hope and expect the same here.

[CannonFire]

No, I know what "the market" says... my point the whole time has been that it would be foolish for Tampa to follow that trend. Pay him what he should make, not what other teams think other players should make.

That's not how it works...otherwise Mahomes would remain the highest paid QB in the NFL.

The market dictates salaries and that's why most new contracts are higher than before, even for players that aren't as good as previously signed ones.

If the Bucs want Mayfield, he's likely going to cost a lot of money. I get that you don't think they should go for him, but if the organization thinks he'll be the best path forward, they'll pay him a lot of money.

LOL, yeah, I just said that. Other teams follow that path for the most part, and it's not really productive... the Bucs should not do that, and they don't have to. You bring up PFF's rating for Mayfield at 77.2, right? Gardner Minshew had a 62 rating from PFF in 14.3 games worth of snaps. Pro-rate that over 17 games worth of starts and you get 73.5.

Mayfield had a 54.3 QBR last season, that ranked 18th... that's 5 spots below #13 Gardner Minshew at 59.6. Willing to bet we can get him here at $8M. Mayfield's career passer rating is 88.1 while Minshew is at 90.2.

[CannonFire]

PFF has Baker at 77.2 this year which solidifies him as a quality starter not replacement level player, but keep up your hate for Mayfield



https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-gr ... erformance.

77.2, the QB number #20. Out of 41 QBs. Behind Jake Browning, Geno Smith, Russell Wilson to name a few.

Turnover worthy plays - #18. So upper half of QBs making turnover worthy plays (bad)
Pressure to sack - #18. So upper half of QBs taking sacks off pressure (bad)
Batted Throws - #20. League median for batted throws.
Big Time Throws - #20. League median for great throws.

All the PFF data shows that Baker is slightly below average for QB play. In what world is that "quality starter"? You should want, you NEED your QB playing in the top quartile to win anything.

The top quartile QBs this year per PFF:
Josh Allen - Divisional Round
Patrick Mahomes - Superbowl
Lamar Jackson - AFC Championship
Dak Prescott - Wildcard
Matthew Stafford - Wild Card
Brock Purdy - Superbowl
Tua Tagovailoa - Wild Card
Jalen Hurts - Wild Card
Kirk Cousins - Injury
Jared Goff - NFC Championship

The only one to not make playoffs was Kirk, and he was out injured. 9 of the 14 playoff QBs were top quartile, including both Superbowl contenders and all championship contenders.

We need Baker to step it up, we need an elite defense, or we need a new QB. Those are our paths to winning.


The Baker data is also skewed by his playoff performance. He was even worse during the regular season.

Kenny Pickett in 12 games had a 70.6 grade from PFF, and some people think the Steelers should replace him. LOL... and he's making less than $4M this year.

Yeah, every single metric available says that Mayfield is a below average starter. There's not one that says he's worth $30M+.