Chris Godwin Thread

[Snake]

Having the best player of all time helps everything make sense. Having a good enough team in place to entice said player to sign there reflects well on the GM, to be sure.

Only 3 teams being interested in TB12 when he hit UFA is the part that’s hard to believe.

I think the job he has done rebuilding this team in the past week is equal to the job he did building it in the first place. Licht is everything you want in a GM.

He drafts fairly well and can make good FA deals.

I don’t hate Licht like I used to. I just hope that 2021 draft doesn’t end up as disastrous as it appears.

[King Bootz]

Having the best player of all time helps everything make sense. Having a good enough team in place to entice said player to sign there reflects well on the GM, to be sure.

Only 3 teams being interested in TB12 when he hit UFA is the part that’s hard to believe.

I think the job he has done rebuilding this team in the past week is equal to the job he did building it in the first place. Licht is everything you want in a GM.

He drafts fairly well and can make good FA deals.

I wouldn't call this roster "rebuilt" in the past week. At minimum 5 starters from last year still need to be replaced or re-signed (Suh, Gholston, Gronk, LF, Cappa or Marpet depending on where Mason plays). There's still spots like safety, EDGE that could still be question marks. Did JTS show enough to be given a starting job? What about Mike Edwards?

I agree with @Snake
Having Brady helps a ton. Without his return who knows what this roster would look like had he decided it wasn't his time to retire yet.

[Primeminister]

I think the job he has done rebuilding this team in the past week is equal to the job he did building it in the first place. Licht is everything you want in a GM.

He drafts fairly well and can make good FA deals.

I wouldn't call this roster "rebuilt" in the past week. At minimum 5 starters from last year still need to be replaced or re-signed (Suh, Gholston, Gronk, LF, Cappa or Marpet depending on where Mason plays). There's still spots like safety, EDGE that could still be question marks. Did JTS show enough to be given a starting job? What about Mike Edwards?

I agree with @Snake
Having Brady helps a ton. Without his return who knows what this roster would look like had he decided it wasn't his time to retire yet.

Brady is here because of the roster that Licht built therefore Licht gets equal credit.

[King Bootz]

JTS definitely didn't show enough to earn a starting spot.

I don't think he did either. I was honestly more impressed with Anthony Nelson this year overall and I think OBP was too. EDGE players who can't set an edge and do nothing but rush upfield don't have long careers.

[Snake]

Gronk on Tryon in July 2021:

"He’s big, he’s lengthy, which is what you want. He’s strong, too, but we’ll really see what he has when we put the pads on.”

Simple statement, but ultimately correct. What does JTS have?

[King Bootz]

Great length and he's strong? Beyond that who knows. I had to go to the old site to find what I said during preseason. Nothing has changed.

Tryon was dynamic last night against backup linemen. Great get off. But what I noticed and was confirmed with a closer look though, he doesn't use his hands AT ALL. He tried to win with speed on each snap. A smaller issue is that he lined up in the neutral zone quite a bit. But that will be cleaned up quickly with film study.

Winning with speed works in August. In September and beyond that gets you benched. He definitely has the tools. But this kid has a long way to go.

[Terry Tate]

I don't think he did either. I was honestly more impressed with Anthony Nelson this year overall and I think OBP was too. EDGE players who can't set an edge and do nothing but rush upfield don't have long careers.

When I see him line up, I think Simeon Rice. Then the ball is snapped.


And Rice deserves more love IMO. If for nothing else, for being such an interesting cat. Oh, and a f'n freak on the field.

Rice should get a lot more consideration for the Hall.

[The Outsider]

Gronk on Tryon in July 2021:

"He’s big, he’s lengthy, which is what you want. He’s strong, too, but we’ll really see what he has when we put the pads on.”

Simple statement, but ultimately correct. What does JTS have?

What's the Ole saying we all heard in High School?

Looks great getting off the bus.


Or


Looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane.

When JPP was completely out in the beginning of the season JTS had like 3 or 4 sacks while rotating with Nelson, when JPP came back he dropped back to third in the rotation and his snap count went way down. Nothing I saw from JTS made me think he's going to suck. I didn't see anything that made me think he'd be a superstar either but he's a glorified 2nd round pick at a position where we had 2 legit starters and 1 depth guy who had been here for a while, so in my opinion his contributions last season were exactly what should have been expected of him. He put in some quality snaps when he was given the opportunity to be on the field.

[The Outsider]

When JPP was completely out in the beginning of the season JTS had like 3 or 4 sacks while rotating with Nelson, when JPP came back he dropped back to third in the rotation and his snap count went way down. Nothing I saw from JTS made me think he's going to suck. I didn't see anything that made me think he'd be a superstar either but he's a glorified 2nd round pick at a position where we had 2 legit starters and 1 depth guy who had been here for a while, so in my opinion his contributions last season were exactly what should have been expected of him. He put in some quality snaps when he was given the opportunity to be on the field.

I didn't say he is an absolute bust nor the 2nd coming.

As much as it pains me to admit; I do agree with Bootz that the kid needs to do much better setting the edge to be successful.

Yeah, I wasn't saying you did. Simply offering my opinion on the player. I agree with you guys about him needing to do a better job setting the edge. That said, it isn't a surprise as that was one of the knocks on him coming out of college. I hope our coaching staff has been after him to bulk up because at 6'5 260 he has the room to add another 10-15 lbs to his frame which would do wonders for that aspect of his game.

[The Outsider]

Yeah, considering at 5'9 210 he makes me look like a fat child.

[Terry Tate]

When JPP was completely out in the beginning of the season JTS had like 3 or 4 sacks while rotating with Nelson, when JPP came back he dropped back to third in the rotation and his snap count went way down. Nothing I saw from JTS made me think he's going to suck. I didn't see anything that made me think he'd be a superstar either but he's a glorified 2nd round pick at a position where we had 2 legit starters and 1 depth guy who had been here for a while, so in my opinion his contributions last season were exactly what should have been expected of him. He put in some quality snaps when he was given the opportunity to be on the field.

I didn't say he is an absolute bust nor the 2nd coming.

As much as it pains me to admit; I do agree with Bootz that the kid needs to do much better setting the edge to be successful.

Let's not forget he's a rookie. If he was set to be an all pro on day one, he wouldn't have been there for us to draft. We drafted a raw talent It's up to the coaches and JTS himself to correct his remaining weaknesses. So far, he's shown enough flashes for me to be happy.

[Cheb]

JTS did decent in relief duty. On some snaps he looked unstoppable, but that seemed to be more luck than anything else.

A big issue he has is finishing at the quarterback. Last year he was a half second away from another half dozen sacks that he just couldn't finish off. That should hopefully improve with time and reps, as his processing should speed up so that he can use his natural talents and start playing truly fast. Think less, rush more.

I agree with the consensus of the board as well that JTS needs to add some more power to his speed. If he can learn to covert speed-to-power, he's going to be a tough motherfucker to block. Till that time, he's strictly a rotational rusher.

Also agree with Bootz that Nelson looked better last season than JTS did.

[mdb1958]

JTS did decent in relief duty. On some snaps he looked unstoppable, but that seemed to be more luck than anything else.

A big issue he has is finishing at the quarterback. Last year he was a half second away from another half dozen sacks that he just couldn't finish off. That should hopefully improve with time and reps, as his processing should speed up so that he can use his natural talents and start playing truly fast. Think less, rush more.

I agree with the consensus of the board as well that JTS needs to add some more power to his speed. If he can learn to covert speed-to-power, he's going to be a tough motherfucker to block. Till that time, he's strictly a rotational rusher.

Also agree with Bootz that Nelson looked better last season than JTS did.

Nelson: 13 solo tackles - 5 of them were sacks.

[Backside]

And JTS and Nelson both looked better than JPP.

[Snake]

And JTS and Nelson both looked better than JPP.

JPP was physically wrecked. When healthy he’s the most physical edge we had. Haven’t heard much news about him…

[The Outsider]

Yeah, considering at 5'9 210 he makes me look like a fat child.

You slimmed down? Trying to be a twink?

20 bucks is 20 bucks.

[kaimaru]

@Doctor I literally could have posted a string of a dozen emails where you said he was pushing for 25 million minimum and 20 flat is "splitting the difference" but please double down on you 12 to 15 shitty takes on why we couldn't get a deal done.

The truth is he he believed he was worth 25 mill. He wouldn't have taken a 20% paycut over 3 years. I pushed you on this more than once you pounded your chest multiple times. Just take the loss.

I mean if you really need some internet message board win for validation, have at it. It's yours. But it isn't a 20% cut over 3 years- just 2. He was locked into the discounted rate in year 1 via the franchise tag.

That’s some BIG mental gymnastics right there. You said market value was 25/year. You were wrong, no need to try and justify your wrongness.

Do you think the FO just offered this 3/$60M deal for the first time this week? Of course not. That offer has been sitting on Godwin's desk for weeks.

The only thing that changed recently was Godwin's chances of hitting the market dropping to 0% once he got officially tagged.

I see, so you work at OBP. Can I know what department and how you are aware of these "facts"?

How about this "fact"? It was a complete surprise to Godwin that he was going to be tagged. The second they tagged he went "welp, might as well sign it now. Dang it gathered a lot of dust sitting here." Might as well add in the "fact" that Brady told him in confidence that he was playing 3 more years with the Bucs so he was running to OBP to sign it.

How about more reality. Licht likes to sign on his prized players to 4+ years. Shaq 4, Evans 5, LVD before last year 5, Ryan Jensen's original contract 5. (The last two are shorter on their contract because of age. Jensen said of this contract that he wants to retire a Buc).

He wanted to lock him up like he locked up Evans for 5 years. He didn't want it. Money was the same per year with probably 60 in guaranteed money. He didn't want that because at age 31 going to his last contract, he would get significantly less than he would at 29. Which is more believable? Oh wait, did you confirm which department you are in and how you were involved in negotiations?

[kaimaru]

I think the job he has done rebuilding this team in the past week is equal to the job he did building it in the first place. Licht is everything you want in a GM.

He drafts fairly well and can make good FA deals.

I wouldn't call this roster "rebuilt" in the past week. At minimum 5 starters from last year still need to be replaced or re-signed (Suh, Gholston, Gronk, LF, Cappa or Marpet depending on where Mason plays). There's still spots like safety, EDGE that could still be question marks. Did JTS show enough to be given a starting job? What about Mike Edwards?

I agree with @Snake
Having Brady helps a ton. Without his return who knows what this roster would look like had he decided it wasn't his time to retire yet.

I don't think Gholston is hard to replace. Mason has been a career RG so he will take over for Cappa. As far as replacing Marpet, they may feel Stinnie is ready for the job. They might be looking for just a backup or a rookie to groom. Gronk is all but back. There is a video on youtube at a barber where someone asks him if he was coming back now that Brady is back. He said he's pretty sure, and that he wants Tommy to sweat it out like he had to when he retired. That could mean we really only need a third safety, backup dline, backup oline, starting 3-4 DE or 3 technique DT, and a starter and backup RB. That's really not bad this point in free agency. If they think Stinnie is ready, we really can go mostly BPA in the draft and fill all the backup rolls after with cheap free agents.

[Snake]

Not trying to be an ass, but…

If anyone else in the entire league thought Stinnie was a dude ready to start, he wouldn’t be re-signing here for a one year deal making not terribly much $.

I wouldn’t overpay Gholston, but I also wouldn’t underrate how nice it is to have a 3-4 DE you just don’t have to worry about. When they suck, it’s a problem.

Glad I’m not a GM.

[Dread]

Not the right thread but I'd bet we re-sign Gholston.

If Zion Johnson is there at 27 I'd be surprised if we passed despite the trade for Mason.

If so the new Oline would be a menace run blocking. Perhaps a small drop-off in pass blocking since Marpet was elite there, but that's still a strong oline we'd have.

Gholston and Suh can be re-signed if needed. But if we can get younger at either spot without a performance dropoff that is good also.

[Doctor]

I mean if you really need some internet message board win for validation, have at it. It's yours. But it isn't a 20% cut over 3 years- just 2. He was locked into the discounted rate in year 1 via the franchise tag.



Do you think the FO just offered this 3/$60M deal for the first time this week? Of course not. That offer has been sitting on Godwin's desk for weeks.

The only thing that changed recently was Godwin's chances of hitting the market dropping to 0% once he got officially tagged.

I see, so you work at OBP. Can I know what department and how you are aware of these "facts"?

How about this "fact"? It was a complete surprise to Godwin that he was going to be tagged. The second they tagged he went "welp, might as well sign it now. Dang it gathered a lot of dust sitting here." Might as well add in the "fact" that Brady told him in confidence that he was playing 3 more years with the Bucs so he was running to OBP to sign it.

How about more reality. Licht likes to sign on his prized players to 4+ years. Shaq 4, Evans 5, LVD before last year 5, Ryan Jensen's original contract 5. (The last two are shorter on their contract because of age. Jensen said of this contract that he wants to retire a Buc).

He wanted to lock him up like he locked up Evans for 5 years. He didn't want it. Money was the same per year with probably 60 in guaranteed money. He didn't want that because at age 31 going to his last contract, he would get significantly less than he would at 29. Which is more believable? Oh wait, did you confirm which department you are in and how you were involved in negotiations?

I'm not saying any of these are confirmed facts, I'm just telling you my opinion of where inductive reasoning of the facts we do know of take you. When the tag was placed, the contracts other players are signing, what Godwin signed for and when. You can disagree. That's perfectly allowed. I'm not going to be mean or make a big deal about one or more of 7 billion people disagreeing with me. But I really do think Godwin wanted to hit the market and hit it big, like a fatter Kirk contract in Jax if not tagged. I think he could've pulled around $25M. If Arob wanted it he could've too but he's been stuck with losers too long, he wants a ring. Maybe we'll see next year with Hill and Kupp. But they'll likely be tagged too.

I mean this just makes sense to me. Not you? Cool.

[IronDog]

When JPP was completely out in the beginning of the season JTS had like 3 or 4 sacks while rotating with Nelson, when JPP came back he dropped back to third in the rotation and his snap count went way down. Nothing I saw from JTS made me think he's going to suck. I didn't see anything that made me think he'd be a superstar either but he's a glorified 2nd round pick at a position where we had 2 legit starters and 1 depth guy who had been here for a while, so in my opinion his contributions last season were exactly what should have been expected of him. He put in some quality snaps when he was given the opportunity to be on the field.

I didn't say he is an absolute bust nor the 2nd coming.

As much as it pains me to admit; I do agree with Bootz that the kid needs to do much better setting the edge to be successful.

Demerol-worthy pain, or climb in the bottle type?

[kaimaru]

I see, so you work at OBP. Can I know what department and how you are aware of these "facts"?

How about this "fact"? It was a complete surprise to Godwin that he was going to be tagged. The second they tagged he went "welp, might as well sign it now. Dang it gathered a lot of dust sitting here." Might as well add in the "fact" that Brady told him in confidence that he was playing 3 more years with the Bucs so he was running to OBP to sign it.

How about more reality. Licht likes to sign on his prized players to 4+ years. Shaq 4, Evans 5, LVD before last year 5, Ryan Jensen's original contract 5. (The last two are shorter on their contract because of age. Jensen said of this contract that he wants to retire a Buc).

He wanted to lock him up like he locked up Evans for 5 years. He didn't want it. Money was the same per year with probably 60 in guaranteed money. He didn't want that because at age 31 going to his last contract, he would get significantly less than he would at 29. Which is more believable? Oh wait, did you confirm which department you are in and how you were involved in negotiations?

I'm not saying any of these are confirmed facts, I'm just telling you my opinion of where inductive reasoning of the facts we do know of take you. When the tag was placed, the contracts other players are signing, what Godwin signed for and when. You can disagree. That's perfectly allowed. I'm not going to be mean or make a big deal about one or more of 7 billion people disagreeing with me. But I really do think Godwin wanted to hit the market and hit it big, like a fatter Kirk contract in Jax if not tagged. I think he could've pulled around $25M. If Arob wanted it he could've too but he's been stuck with losers too long, he wants a ring. Maybe we'll see next year with Hill and Kupp. But they'll likely be tagged too.

I mean this just makes sense to me. Not you? Cool.

@Doctor I wouldn't have even replied if you hadn't said that exact offer was on his desk for weeks like it was a fact. Green Bay said they offered Davante Adams more than the Raiders and he turned them down. It then came out later, that they offered to MATCH the Las Vegas contract and termed it down. I have no problem with you.