Are we ready to be honest yet?

[acmillis]

IMO, nobody can be the GOAT in their respective sport with just six seasons at the helm unless they quite literally have six rings and six MVPs in that time frame.

[uscbucsfan1]

Wild stat.

[Doctor]

IMO, nobody can be the GOAT in their respective sport with just six seasons at the helm unless they quite literally have six rings and six MVPs in that time frame.

Funny because that's exactly how MJ gets viewed.

[acmillis]

IMO, nobody can be the GOAT in their respective sport with just six seasons at the helm unless they quite literally have six rings and six MVPs in that time frame.

Funny because that's exactly how MJ gets viewed.

I'm not sure I understand your post, but IU think you're saying that MJ is viewed as the GOAT because of a six year stretch? If so, that's a terrible take.

He was a 10 time All NBA first teamer.
He was a nine time All Defense first teamer.
He was a 10 time scoring champion.
He was a three time steals leader.


MJ left the game, came back, and was still the GOAT.

[Doctor]

People make it seem like MJ walked onto the scene, dropped 6 chips, and left. But he's got a whole career filled with not winning people pretend didn't happen. Helps them ignore that outside Phil and Pippin, MJ was much closer to his GOAT peers.

[CannonFire]

I'm the biggest Brady fan. But being honest he wasn't doing what Mahomes is. This also doesn't include the 6 Pro Bowls & 2 league MVP awards Mahomes has.

The only legitimate argument at this point that Brady has is longevity. I doubt Mahomes plays 23 seasons. But I don't think 7 is the number that needs to be reached to solidify that Patrick Mahomes is the best.

Rule changes in 2008 made the NFL significantly more pass dominate... Brady was 31.

I think Mahomes is a stud, but the metric is disingenuous.

[Buc2]

I'm the biggest Brady fan. But being honest he wasn't doing what Mahomes is. This also doesn't include the 6 Pro Bowls & 2 league MVP awards Mahomes has.

The only legitimate argument at this point that Brady has is longevity. I doubt Mahomes plays 23 seasons. But I don't think 7 is the number that needs to be reached to solidify that Patrick Mahomes is the best.

Rule changes in 2008 made the NFL significantly more pass dominate... Brady was 31.

I think Mahomes is a stud, but the metric is disingenuous.

Using metrics like this, people would say QB’s like Starr and Unitas sucked.

[Navybuc]

Mahomes is on his way to being the GOAT. He’s not there yet…but give him time.

[CannonFire]

Rule changes in 2008 made the NFL significantly more pass dominate... Brady was 31.

I think Mahomes is a stud, but the metric is disingenuous.

Using metrics like this, people would say QB’s like Starr and Unitas sucked.

Exactly

[Digital_Damage]

This is horse is glue by now.

But just to cut through the bullshit for the 100th time.

1) Brady is still the Best ever...
2) Mahomes is the Best active QB in the new rule's era...
3) Mahomes will have to eclipse all of Brady's Career stats to be considered the best... No IF's or Buts... see Montana vs Brady Debate.
4) Bootz is still a moron....

[Backside]

Mahomes will have the numbers for sure and he’s on a great Super Bowl trajectory.

He’s incredible and I’ve never seen anyone like him. I think for these conversations we do have to keep in mind that Brady’s career spanned different eras and at one point he played in a game where a QB could take this hit:



Not a flag, controversy, nothing. Just football. Mahomes plays in an era where he can look for a flag if he takes any kind of contact whatsoever on a throw, and will often get them. Not the determining factor, but 30 years from now when Mahomes blows Brady out of the water on pure stats I feel like these details will be important to remember.

[acmillis]

Not sure what point I’m trying to make, or if I’m even trying to make one.
But day had Peyton to be compared to in real time. Mahomes has…nobody, I guess?
Does that help/hurt either of their legacy’s?

[kaimaru]

Not sure what point I’m trying to make, or if I’m even trying to make one.
But day had Peyton to be compared to in real time. Mahomes has…nobody, I guess?
Does that help/hurt either of their legacy’s?

I think one important stat is Mahomes is 15-3 in the playoffs. He has an 0-2 record versus Brady. That may always be brought up against him

[uscbucsfan1]

Not sure what point I’m trying to make, or if I’m even trying to make one.
But day had Peyton to be compared to in real time. Mahomes has…nobody, I guess?
Does that help/hurt either of their legacy’s?

I think one important stat is Mahomes is 15-3 in the playoffs. He has an 0-2 record versus Brady. That may always be brought up against him

That's as relevant as Brady being 0-2 against Eli.

QBs don't face head to head. They face the opposing D.

[Jonny]

Mahomes is an all time great. I would be willing to crown him the GOAT if he sustains success after changing of guard both with his HC as well as HoFer Kelce. As Snake pointed out, he was thrust into an ideal situation and to his credit maximized the opportunity. But Brady's success is transcendent because of what he did in 2010s and in Tampa. He reinvented himself multiple times during the career to suit what weapons and system he had at his disposal. It is possible Mahomes is just as capable, but until I see it, I will hold Mahomes inferior to Brady unless he wins 8 rings.b

[Jonny]

I think one important stat is Mahomes is 15-3 in the playoffs. He has an 0-2 record versus Brady. That may always be brought up against him

That's as relevant as Brady being 0-2 against Eli.

QBs don't face head to head. They face the opposing D.

But Eli is not in the GOAT conversation. Of course QBs don't face head to head, but they were in the same situation twice for all the marbles.

[CannonFire]

Every time I come to this board, like all of you, I see this thread. It's actually my favorite. It's my favorite because of the irony. I laugh every time I read the title "Are we ready to be honest yet?". Why do I laugh? Because while asking everyone if they're ready to be honest, the OP poses said question amid a dishonest criteria.

[GreatTimes]

Brady or Mahomes? Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder.

[mdb1958]

Brady being a 6th rounder is like a Chinese bike and Mahomes being a 1st is a 500cc motocross. Surfing the largest wave still goes to Brady.

[BucsNBills]

This is disrespectful to Brady. Mahomes hasn't earned this comparison yet. It also lacks all context that went into Brady's era of play and Mahomes.

Brady didn't even have any good offense weapons until 2007, where you know he had the single greatest QB season of all time and went undefeated in the regular season.

The second the league started changing to it's current state, Brady started putting up incredible numbers.

And Mahomes had a shot at sending Brady home in the afccg AND the super bowl, and he failed both times. Meanwhile Brady showed what clutch looks like in both games.

I know, Mahomes is the new shiny manufactured face of the league, and he lacks Brady's unfortunate immutable physical characteristic which is frowned upon in 2024. But it's insulting to both he and more importantly, Brady, to begin these comparisons before Mahomes has properly earned it.

[Navybuc]

This is disrespectful to Brady. Mahomes hasn't earned this comparison yet. It also lacks all context that went into Brady's era of play and Mahomes.

Brady didn't even have any good offense weapons until 2007, where you know he had the single greatest QB season of all time and went undefeated in the regular season.

The second the league started changing to it's current state, Brady started putting up incredible numbers.

And Mahomes had a shot at sending Brady home in the afccg AND the super bowl, and he failed both times. Meanwhile Brady showed what clutch looks like in both games.

I know, Mahomes is the new shiny manufactured face of the league, and he lacks Brady's unfortunate immutable physical characteristic which is frowned upon in 2024. But it's insulting to both he and more importantly, Brady, to begin these comparisons before Mahomes has properly earned it.

Best way to put it is “He’s on track” but he’s not there yet. Still a ways to go. Tiger was on track to beating Jack Nicklaus’ record until he got hurt and everything got derailed. Anything can happen in life.

[Bootz]

It's disrespectful to Tom Brady to compare him to a young QB that has in most cases better accolades than he did at the same point of his career?

What's truly disrespectful is this idiotic belief that you can't compare past greats to present and future ones.

[Four Verticals]

I know, Mahomes is the new shiny manufactured face of the league, and he lacks Brady's unfortunate immutable physical characteristic which is frowned upon in 2024. But it's insulting to both he and more importantly, Brady, to begin these comparisons before Mahomes has properly earned it.

Saying its insulting to compare Mahomes to Brady at this point in Mahomes career is insulting to anyone who pays attention to football at all.

Is Mahomes there yet? No. But he's certainly both on track to be there and a better player than Brady was at the stage of career Mahomes is at this point than Brady was at that point.

[Doctor]

No one is saying you can't compare, you just have to adjust for inflation.

[Bootz]

No one is saying you can't compare, you just have to adjust for inflation.

LUGZ is quite literally saying that.