Lol, Baker was better than all of those QBs this season.
Better at turning the ball over
Lol, okay.
And better at throwing TDs. Better at RZ efficiency. Better completion%. better in Passer Rating. Better on 3rd downs. Better vs. the blitz. Better in CPOE. Better in virtually every statistical category/metric/analysis. And that's in spite of the turnovers.
But troll on if it makes you happy.
Last edited by Sooner06 on Thu Jan 30, 2025 5:00 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Doctor wrote: ↑Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:02 pm
Baker is a modern day love child between Cam Newton and Brett Favre. Say what you will of it, you can win with it.
Is the current iteration of the sport even comparable to 2014, let alone 1995?
And how is he comparable to Cam? Who in his prime was rushing for 600 yards and 10+ touchdowns per year.
Below are Baker’s rushing statistics
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Baker is a gunslinger. You can win with him but he's also best as a front runner like Cam, not so much so for come from behind. While Cam was mentally weak Baker is the opposite, he's a try hard, too hard. But he's a play maker and can rally.
Either way, more then merits building around for a window.
CannonFire wrote: ↑Wed Jan 29, 2025 6:08 pm
Mayfield is fine as long as he has a contract that is easy to get out from under. He shouldn't be paid $40M and should never carry a cap hit of more than $20M (I'd prefer $15M). As I've said before, there's literally only 5 guys better than everyone else and about 25 guys who are virtually the same player and given the right situation, can look better than somewhere else. Mayfield is one of the 25, not 5. No team should ever pay any of those 25 guys more than $20 to $25M a year and their deals should never last more than 3 at a time (after their rookie contract). The contract Mayfield got, all but guaranteed 1 of 2 outcomes at the end of this season... he was either going to be released or have his contract restructured. Hopefully Licht does the smart thing and give him a 2-yr extension to wipe out those void years, give him cash, and spread out the bonus over next year and the 3 remaining. If we can get someone this draft to replace Baker after the 2025 season, then that's what should happen.
I like the general idea but I disagree that 6-30 are the same QB. No one is going to confuse Mayfield for Mahomes or Allen but he is a clear step up from the middle of the pack guys.
Just out of curiosity, who are your 5 guys. For me the obvious answers are Mahomes, Allen, Burrow and Jackson. That 5th spot is open for debate and is closer to being in the Mayfield tier rather than that S tier.
The 5th is Justin Herbert. I think he's clearly better than everyone other than the other 4. I have no qualms saying 1-4, then 5, and then the rest. But he literally would make the other 27 teams better than the guy they have now.
The reason I'm going to 30 is that I'm cutting the rookies and 2nd year guys some slack. If you want to say 6 through 25 (give or take), then the 1st and 2nd year guys, that's fine too. My point is, the vast majority of the starters in the NFL, given the right circumstances, are interchangeable. For an example, if next year we swapped QB's with any one of say 20-25 other teams, we'd definitely be worse? Who do you think would make a definitive negative impact on this team next year? I'm willing to bet you'd have more rookies than veterans on your list. For arguments sake, let's assume cap hit doesn't matter. Just talking about ability to play.
CannonFire wrote: ↑Wed Jan 29, 2025 6:08 pm
Mayfield is fine as long as he has a contract that is easy to get out from under. He shouldn't be paid $40M and should never carry a cap hit of more than $20M (I'd prefer $15M). As I've said before, there's literally only 5 guys better than everyone else and about 25 guys who are virtually the same player and given the right situation, can look better than somewhere else. Mayfield is one of the 25, not 5. No team should ever pay any of those 25 guys more than $20 to $25M a year and their deals should never last more than 3 at a time (after their rookie contract). The contract Mayfield got, all but guaranteed 1 of 2 outcomes at the end of this season... he was either going to be released or have his contract restructured. Hopefully Licht does the smart thing and give him a 2-yr extension to wipe out those void years, give him cash, and spread out the bonus over next year and the 3 remaining. If we can get someone this draft to replace Baker after the 2025 season, then that's what should happen.
That’s the first time I agree with you right there.
CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 31, 2025 3:26 pm
The 5th is Justin Herbert. I think he's clearly better than everyone other than the other 4. I have no qualms saying 1-4, then 5, and then the rest. But he literally would make the other 27 teams better than the guy they have now.
Sorry man, you lost me there. Not saying Herbert is a bad or even average QB. But how many times have you seen the guy put his team on the back and ball out? He is like a better built version of Chad Pennington. You can win in the regular season with that maybe, but come playoffs a QB needs to be willing to sling it with a bit of reckless abandon and have a lot more good plays than bad. Herbert's biggest issue is, the moment he turns into a gunslinger, he starts making bad plays. He can only play good controlled and conservative, which is good for regular season against inferior competition.
One thing you will have to credit Baker with is his willingness to realize the sense of urgency and try to take over a game. He is not Lamar or Allen, but he will put his body on the line regardless. That competitive spirit is necessary for a champion in my opinion. The way Baker is playing now, we can win it all with him.
Last, but not least, the guy is electric in playoffs. Easily 5th best QB QB ahead of Lamar and behind Jayden Daniels.
Grahamburn wrote: ↑Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:51 pm
Quietly the 2nd best rushing season from a Tampa QB ever.
Anyone know who’s first without looking it up?
Just saw this. Vinny once popped off like a 60 yard run. I'm gonna guess him and that run inflated the hell out of his total and artificially gives him 1st place
CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 31, 2025 3:26 pm
The 5th is Justin Herbert. I think he's clearly better than everyone other than the other 4. I have no qualms saying 1-4, then 5, and then the rest. But he literally would make the other 27 teams better than the guy they have now.
Sorry man, you lost me there. Not saying Herbert is a bad or even average QB. But how many times have you seen the guy put his team on the back and ball out? He is like a better built version of Chad Pennington. You can win in the regular season with that maybe, but come playoffs a QB needs to be willing to sling it with a bit of reckless abandon and have a lot more good plays than bad. Herbert's biggest issue is, the moment he turns into a gunslinger, he starts making bad plays. He can only play good controlled and conservative, which is good for regular season against inferior competition.
One thing you will have to credit Baker with is his willingness to realize the sense of urgency and try to take over a game. He is not Lamar or Allen, but he will put his body on the line regardless. That competitive spirit is necessary for a champion in my opinion. The way Baker is playing now, we can win it all with him.
Last, but not least, the guy is electric in playoffs. Easily 5th best QB QB ahead of Lamar and behind Jayden Daniels.
I think we fully ride out this Baker window. I always think you should hedge QB, and if a nice enough guy falls I'm all for it. But I think this staff likes what they've seen from Pratt and hope he can double as the hedge too.
But this is definitely the Baker Evans Bucky window. OL all signed up too but Ben.
Doctor wrote: ↑Sun Feb 02, 2025 3:10 pm
I think we fully ride out this Baker window. I always think you should hedge QB, and if a nice enough guy falls I'm all for it. But I think this staff likes what they've seen from Pratt and hope he can double as the hedge too.
But this is definitely the Baker Evans Bucky window. OL all signed up too but Ben.
Was he back up Ben or starter Ben before we got him
Young eh? In 1986? Brother was running for his life probably.
Yo @0-26 Survivor any truth that the expansion Yucks could beat that 86 team? I keep hearing it but I wasn't born yet
Hard to say. ‘86 had some really solid players. But then……
My personal deciding factor?
Leeman Bennett. He s-u-c-k-e-d.
Sadly enough that's all I ever heard.
My dad argued Ray Perkins was worse because "There is no real difference between losing 14 or 11 games a season when you're always losing by 30 points"
He also said, "One guy had Bo Jackson refuse to play for him and all his best players released to save money. He had nothing to work with and no idea what to do. The other had a team that might have gone .500 if they weren't all dead after 5 and 6 games into the season from from his 3 a day practices"
It sounds like the 80s were far worse than the 2010s
0-26 Survivor wrote: ↑Sun Feb 02, 2025 6:52 pmSwashy…..of all the coaches the the Bucs have had in their history, the one that honestly made me sick when I looked at him was Bennett.
Go figure.
Perkins was a genius compared to him.
I will take anyone over Shitano - God, he was a pile of garbage as a coach and as a human.
I said what I said
I've got a soft heart and a savage mouth.
I'm like a Hallmark card written by Tupac.
0-26 Survivor wrote: ↑Sun Feb 02, 2025 6:52 pmSwashy…..of all the coaches the the Bucs have had in their history, the one that honestly made me sick when I looked at him was Bennett.
Go figure.
Perkins was a genius compared to him.
I will take anyone over Shitano - God, he was a pile of garbage as a coach and as a human.
Sam Wyche was my 1st. He is underrated because people say "Dungy's team" when transition to Gruden but Sam layed the roots and was the one who Drafted Sapp Brooks Lynch and Dilfer.
Does anyone think Dilfer would have fared better in 02 compared to Johnson?
Central_Buc wrote: ↑Tue Feb 04, 2025 7:03 am
Sam Wyche was my 1st. He is underrated because people say "Dungy's team" when transition to Gruden but Sam layed the roots and was the one who Drafted Sapp Brooks Lynch and Dilfer.
Does anyone think Dilfer would have fared better in 02 compared to Johnson?
Central_Buc wrote: ↑Tue Feb 04, 2025 7:03 am
Sam Wyche was my 1st. He is underrated because people say "Dungy's team" when transition to Gruden but Sam layed the roots and was the one who Drafted Sapp Brooks Lynch and Dilfer.
Does anyone think Dilfer would have fared better in 02 compared to Johnson?
Why would anyone think Dilfer would have fared better than Johnson in '02.
