Baker Mayfield: PAID

[Central_Buc]

Sims has Mayfield above Hurts LOOOOL

I would tend to agree with that. Hurts can't use the whole field, and the only attribute he has that's obviously and significantly superior to Baker is his running ability. Given equal teams, Baker would almost certainly perform better than Hurts, the only real question would be to what degree.

I know

But here I was being antagonistic towards Bootz lickers suck Hurts's balls thread he made after the Superbowl because he is a closet Eagles fan.

[BucsNBills]

I would tend to agree with that. Hurts can't use the whole field, and the only attribute he has that's obviously and significantly superior to Baker is his running ability. Given equal teams, Baker would almost certainly perform better than Hurts, the only real question would be to what degree.

I know

But here I was being antagonistic towards Bootz lickers suck Hurts's balls thread he made after the Superbowl because he is a closet Eagles fan.

He's more of a closet 'Any Team but the Bucs' kind of fan.

[Central_Buc]

I know

But here I was being antagonistic towards Bootz lickers suck Hurts's balls thread he made after the Superbowl because he is a closet Eagles fan.

He's more of a closet 'Any Team but the Bucs' kind of fan.

Well how bout that?

[Buc2]

I have noticed that he does tend to poop on the vast majority of Bucs moves as well as on any Buc fan that shows even the slightest excitement about a move they made. All while mostly praising similar moves by other teams.

[Pirate Life]

I have noticed that he does tend to poop on the vast majority of Bucs moves as well as on any Buc fan that shows even the slightest excitement about a move they made. All while mostly praising similar moves by other teams.

Clearly, the other teams aren't casuals. Tampa Bay is though. Must be the beach and the avocado vodka.

[Grahamburn]

IMG_6357.png

Credit Reddit.

[Pirate Life]

IMG_6357.png

Credit Reddit.

If he understands it, that graphic won't bode well for CF's crusade. Wow.

[Grahamburn]

IMG_6357.png

Credit Reddit.

If he understands it, that graphic won't bode well for CF's crusade. Wow.

Outside of rookie deals it’s arguably the best contract in the entire league.

[Grahamburn]

I have noticed that he does tend to poop on the vast majority of Bucs moves as well as on any Buc fan that shows even the slightest excitement about a move they made. All while mostly praising similar moves by other teams.

Clearly, the other teams aren't casuals. Tampa Bay is though. Must be the beach and the avocado vodka.

I think it was tequila.. Wasn’t it avocado tequila?

[Pirate Life]

Clearly, the other teams aren't casuals. Tampa Bay is though. Must be the beach and the avocado vodka.

I think it was tequila.. Wasn’t it avocado tequila?

You are correct, oddly enough there's an avocado version of both.

[__Chef__]

IMG_6357.png

Credit Reddit.

To be fair on all sides ... Baker was scraping the bottom of the barrel when he showed up here. He had a good year and both sides agreed to a deal which recognized it was one good year after one not so great year ... and up and downs prior to. It was a "hey things are going well, lets both show we are happy with the trajectory", and neither side wants to commit to that 1 year being indicative of all Baker would be here. Baker didn't want that because he thought he could do better. Bucs didn't want to give up the farm on 1 good year, but also wanted Baker to feel like the team was with him and not looking to replace him anytime soon. A reasonable 3 year deal at the time was prudent for both parties. What happens next will be interesting, but I'm willing to bet Baker isn't looking for a statement contract. I think he will go with a fair one, which in this market will still be insane.

[__Chef__]

I know

But here I was being antagonistic towards Bootz lickers suck Hurts's balls thread he made after the Superbowl because he is a closet Eagles fan.

He's more of a closet 'Any Team but the Bucs' kind of fan.

You guys are reading @Bootz wrong here. He wants what is best for the team. Like a father who is tough on his son. It isn't because he doesn't care or doesn't want him to do better. Quite the opposite. He wants his son (our team) to be triumphant. To be the best they can be.

That, and he also likes to jab/argue/poke holes in peoples arguments. Nothing wrong with that. Especially on a message board. Sometimes in brutal fashion, but hey, I'm glad to have him around ... even when he's busting my balls for being wrong.

[Sdbucs]

My expectation is that Baker has the best season of his career thus far in this upcoming season. I think that’s a reasonable expectation for him given the weapons on offense and continuity here.

Our offense is stacked.

[Grahamburn]

My expectation is that Baker has the best season of his career thus far in this upcoming season. I think that’s a reasonable expectation for him given the weapons on offense and continuity here.

Our offense is stacked.

Let's hope so. I think the counting numbers could regress some this season. Not due to his play, but just general regression and if the defense is improved and we'll likely be playing with some leads late instead of catching up or just staying ahead due to defensive ineptitude. We'd all like to see the turnovers reduced. 4,000 yards, 35 TDs, ~10 or so turnovers max would be pretty ideal. With improved defense that's likely a 12+ win season or better...

[__Chef__]

My expectation is that Baker has the best season of his career thus far in this upcoming season. I think that’s a reasonable expectation for him given the weapons on offense and continuity here.

Our offense is stacked.

Let's hope so. I think the counting numbers could regress some this season. Not due to his play, but just general regression and if the defense is improved and we'll likely be playing with some leads late instead of catching up or just staying ahead due to defensive ineptitude. We'd all like to see the turnovers reduced. 4,000 yards, 35 TDs, ~10 or so turnovers max would be pretty ideal. With improved defense that's likely a 12+ win season or better...

Sky's the limit for this offense ... the question is can the defense show meaningful improvement. If they can bump the turnovers up and not give up a ton of points in the first half, I see the offense outperforming last year. 4 minute offense to close out opponents will be the norm.

[Sdbucs]

Kinda funny because an improvement on defense would in theory mean lower stats on offense.

People would say our offense got worse because we put up less stats because…. We werent needing crazy comebacks from the hole our defense put us in

[Grahamburn]

Kinda funny because an improvement on defense would in theory mean lower stats on offense.

People would say our offense got worse because we put up less stats because…. We werent needing crazy comebacks from the hole our defense put us in

Could also mean quicker/shorter scores assuming more turnovers and stops. Majority of our yards/TDs came from 75+ yard drives.

[Pirate Life]

Kinda funny because an improvement on defense would in theory mean lower stats on offense.

People would say our offense got worse because we put up less stats because…. We werent needing crazy comebacks from the hole our defense put us in

Really depends on if Bowles will revert back to being conservative with a lead or go with wanting to keep the pressure on the other team to make things easier for the defense to pin their ears back and rush the passer. And if the defense is not on the field giving up time consuming drives, should be more time/chances for the offense to score.

[mdb1958]

More defensive stops could mean less time on the field and more scoring by our offense. Time of possession and blow outs in our favor. The bigger the deficit the more risk to change it. Making it hard to game plan us could lead to easy wins.

[Central_Buc]

Being that we have imo a strong running game and improving OL, I don't think Time of possession is something to worry about.

[Phantom]

There’s more evidence that he’s better than Mahomes in the past two years.

End of discussion period


@Chef @Central_Buc

[Pirate Life]

There’s more evidence that he’s better than Mahomes in the past two years.

End of discussion period


@Chef @Central_Buc

Mahomes last few seasons show why Brady will still be the GOAT. Mahomes can’t elevate those around him like Brady could. Crazy to think of some of the guys Brady made look serviceable. Mahomes falls off a good bit when he has subpar talent to throw to or protect him.

[Bootz]

There’s more evidence that he’s better than Mahomes in the past two years.

End of discussion period


@Chef @Central_Buc

Mahomes last few seasons show why Brady will still be the GOAT. Mahomes can’t elevate those around him like Brady could. Crazy to think of some of the guys Brady made look serviceable. Mahomes falls off a good bit when he has subpar talent to throw to or protect him.

The only thing this does is this confirms the bar for Mahomes is so insanely high, that there is no discussion about who the best QB in the league is today. Mahomes somehow can't elevate guys around him yet he's literally in the Conference Championship or Superbowl every year.

Mahomes falls off with subpar talent and still somehow is better than everyone else. Crazy. Any talk about Baker or Allen or Burrow or Jackson being in the Mahomes realm is nonsense.


As far as the Brady comparison, are you comparing Mahomes' 8 seasons to Brady's 1st 8 or Mahomes 8 seasons to Brady's full 21 seasons? If it's the former, Mahomes actually clears Brady in every way. If it's the latter, you're comparing incomplete data and it's obviously skewed.

[Buc2]

Very true, @Bootz. The time for comparing Mahomes and Brady will be when Mahomes retires. Till then, it's all speculation.

[__Chef__]

There’s more evidence that he’s better than Mahomes in the past two years.

End of discussion period


@Chef @Central_Buc

On a head to head comp, it's tough to say ... On one hand, Mahomes has been really clutch in getting to the SB. On the other hand, in our SB and the last one, Mahomes folded. One needs to also factor in the coaching staffs and talent surrounding them.

If we had Mahomes last year, we probably win against the Commanders.
If they had Baker last year, they probably don't make it to the Superbowl.

They are a lot more comparable now after Mahomes' two clunkers, but Baker still hasn't reached the SB to see if he can win one, or fold like Mahomes did last year.

Mahomes > Baker ... for now.

[Bootz]

Tough to say??!

[__Chef__]

Tough to say??!

Mahomes has had Andy Reid's coaching staff for every single day of his NFL career. He's also had exactly 1 year where his defense was bottom half in points allowed.

Yeah, he's a great QB, but his supporting staff around him has been quite a contrast to Mayfield's.

[Grahamburn]

Tough to say??!

Mahomes has had Andy Reid's coaching staff for every single day of his NFL career. He's also had exactly 1 year where his defense was bottom half in points allowed.

Yeah, he's a great QB, but his supporting staff around him has been quite a contrast to Mayfield's.

I do agree landing spot is just so huge for these guys.

Does Mahomes become Mahomes if he goes to Cleveland? Man. Think about it.

[Pirate Life]

Mahomes last few seasons show why Brady will still be the GOAT. Mahomes can’t elevate those around him like Brady could. Crazy to think of some of the guys Brady made look serviceable. Mahomes falls off a good bit when he has subpar talent to throw to or protect him.

The only thing this does is this confirms the bar for Mahomes is so insanely high, that there is no discussion about who the best QB in the league is today. Mahomes somehow can't elevate guys around him yet he's literally in the Conference Championship or Superbowl every year.

Mahomes falls off with subpar talent and still somehow is better than everyone else. Crazy. Any talk about Baker or Allen or Burrow or Jackson being in the Mahomes realm is nonsense.


As far as the Brady comparison, are you comparing Mahomes' 8 seasons to Brady's 1st 8 or Mahomes 8 seasons to Brady's full 21 seasons? If it's the former, Mahomes actually clears Brady in every way. If it's the latter, you're comparing incomplete data and it's obviously skewed.

Neither. Comparing how they’ve done on the field when they don’t have great talent around them, not how their teams have done.

Mahomes started his career with a HoF WR, HoF TE and HoF RB in Hill, Kelce and McCoy. For the next three seasons after that he still had Hill and Kelce. Last two seasons with a diminished Kelce are his worst statistically, three of the last four are his worst. Last two seasons KC’s post season success is more due to their defense than Mahomes’ doing. In Mahomes’ three SB wins he had multiple all-pros on offense with him: Kelce, Hill, Thuney, Brown Jr, and Humphries. Hill, Kelce and Thuney also 1st team All-pros during those three seasons as well as Mahomes.

Compared to Brady who won his first three SBs throwing to Troy Brown, David Givens, David Patten, and Deion Branch. Antowain Smith as the RB for the first two, Corey Dillion for the third. Brown was in the Pro Bowl in 2001, Dillion in 2004. Only other Pro Bowl player on offense in those years was Brady. No 1st team All Pros.

[__Chef__]

Mahomes has had Andy Reid's coaching staff for every single day of his NFL career. He's also had exactly 1 year where his defense was bottom half in points allowed.

Yeah, he's a great QB, but his supporting staff around him has been quite a contrast to Mayfield's.

I do agree landing spot is just so huge for these guys.

Does Mahomes become Mahomes if he goes to Cleveland? Man. Think about it.

Also, Baker was || this close to flaming out of the league prior to coming here. Now, after a couple good years with a stable organization, fresh off Brady showing our team what it takes to build a championship, he's put up top 5 numbers and some pundits are even saying he's underrated.

How would Baker have turned out if Andy Reid drafted him to the Chiefs? Who knows, as it sounded like he had some growing up to do in his early years.

Mahomes to Cleveland wouldn't have led to multiple Super bowls, that much is certain.

[Bootz]

The only thing this does is this confirms the bar for Mahomes is so insanely high, that there is no discussion about who the best QB in the league is today. Mahomes somehow can't elevate guys around him yet he's literally in the Conference Championship or Superbowl every year.

Mahomes falls off with subpar talent and still somehow is better than everyone else. Crazy. Any talk about Baker or Allen or Burrow or Jackson being in the Mahomes realm is nonsense.


As far as the Brady comparison, are you comparing Mahomes' 8 seasons to Brady's 1st 8 or Mahomes 8 seasons to Brady's full 21 seasons? If it's the former, Mahomes actually clears Brady in every way. If it's the latter, you're comparing incomplete data and it's obviously skewed.

Neither. Comparing how they’ve done on the field when they don’t have great talent around them, not how their teams have done.

Mahomes started his career with a HoF WR, HoF TE and HoF RB in Hill, Kelce and McCoy. For the next three seasons after that he still had Hill and Kelce. Last two seasons with a diminished Kelce are his worst statistically, three of the last four are his worst. Last two seasons KC’s post season success is more due to their defense than Mahomes’ doing. In Mahomes’ three SB wins he had multiple all-pros on offense with him: Kelce, Hill, Thuney, Brown Jr, and Humphries. Hill, Kelce and Thuney also 1st team All-pros during those three seasons as well as Mahomes.

Compared to Brady who won his first three SBs throwing to Troy Brown, David Givens, David Patten, and Deion Branch. Antowain Smith as the RB for the first two, Corey Dillion for the third. Brown was in the Pro Bowl in 2001, Dillion in 2004. Only other Pro Bowl player on offense in those years was Brady. No 1st team All Pros.

Oh I'm sorry. I thought you were being objective. I'll let you carry on with your bias opinion. And if you think you're not, you basically just said that Tyreek Hill was a HOF after his 2nd season and that LeSean, who spent 1 season in KC and ran for a grand total of 465 yards were carrying Mahomes.

Carry on.

[Bootz]

Main reason people speak so much in hypotheticals is because they know they can never ever be proven or disproven. It just makes them feel smarter.

Shoulda coulda wouldas warm the soul.

[Doctor]

There’s more evidence that he’s better than Mahomes in the past two years.

End of discussion period


@Chef @Central_Buc

Mahomes last few seasons show why Brady will still be the GOAT. Mahomes can’t elevate those around him like Brady could. Crazy to think of some of the guys Brady made look serviceable. Mahomes falls off a good bit when he has subpar talent to throw to or protect him.

Mahomes just led a sorry KC squad to a SB again, what are we talking about?

[Lordnlkon]

Mahomes last few seasons show why Brady will still be the GOAT. Mahomes can’t elevate those around him like Brady could. Crazy to think of some of the guys Brady made look serviceable. Mahomes falls off a good bit when he has subpar talent to throw to or protect him.

Mahomes just led a sorry KC squad to a SB again, what are we talking about?

Yeah that was a pretty silly take. Mahomes has proven to be the only QB in the league who can carry his team.

[Phantom]

Mayfield could potentially make it to the Super Bowl if he has that Chiefs defense.