Rapid response Buc’s lose to the Lions week 7

[mdb1958]

I guess the boys just aren't ready for prime time afterall.

I hope things are going well with you.

[Babeinbucland]

You're so mentally weak and futile.

lol

[13F11B]

You're so mentally weak and futile.

You probably think Baker shares those same traits since he was pretty vocal about the shit officiating.

[IronDog]

I guess the boys just aren't ready for prime time afterall.

I hope things are going well with you.

Thanks for the good thoughts. Mostly, yes. Still carrying my poop in a bag on the outside. But they keep telling me it's temporary. Then again, so is life.

[Grahamburn]

And not a single change will be made.

I don’t know what you’d like them to do? There’s not a starting right tackle and right guard tree they can pluck from.

[Pirate Life]

And not a single change will be made.

I don’t know what you’d like them to do? There’s not a starting right tackle and right guard tree they can pluck from.

If Goedeke needs more time, put Chukwuma out there for Heck. Feeney in for Jordan. Highly doubt they could be worse.

[Buc2]

One thing is certain, it will be interesting to see if any personnel/position changes are made after The Ford Field Disaster.

[Grahamburn]

I don’t know what you’d like them to do? There’s not a starting right tackle and right guard tree they can pluck from.

If Goedeke needs more time, put Chukwuma out there for Heck. Feeney in for Jordan. Highly doubt they could be worse.

I don't think Jordan was close to healthy. It didn't look like he could even move.

We shouldn't have thrown the ball 50 times against that pass rush. That was just stupid.

[Pirate Life]

If Goedeke needs more time, put Chukwuma out there for Heck. Feeney in for Jordan. Highly doubt they could be worse.

I don't think Jordan was close to healthy. It didn't look like he could even move.

We shouldn't have thrown the ball 50 times against that pass rush. That was just stupid.

Probably not, but he's not that mobile to begin with. Was always the weakest link on a bad line in Cincy.

And no, we shouldn't have passed that much. Abandoned the run game way too early, had some decent plays out of it and would have slowed things down. They never bit on play action after the 1st quarter that I can recall.

[Babeinbucland]

"NFL looking out for Detroit": Pat McAfee reacts as controversy erupts over awful officiating during Lions-Buccaneers MNF
Monday Night Football's Lions-Buccaneers showdown devolved into a referee roast as Detroit's 24-9 thrashing ignited a torrent of controversy over phantom calls that seemingly tilted the scales. From a botched review on Cameron Otton's fourth-down grab—initially overturned then bizarrely re-reviewed in violation of rules—to phantom holdings nullifying Tampa's momentum and uncalled pass interference on key third downs, the zebras drew ire for eight glaring gaffes.
sportskeeda.com
Baker Mayfield's offense sputtered at 4.3 yards per attempt, exacerbated by flags that handed Detroit's defense extra life, including three straight Bucs turnovers on downs to ice the clock.
sportskeeda.com
Enter Pat McAfee, whose postgame hot take on his show lit X ablaze: "NFL looking out for Detroit," he quipped, hinting at league favoritism akin to the Chiefs' perceived perks under Roger Goodell.
profootballnetwork.com
The ex-punter-turned-pundit lambasted the "laundry list of apparent gaffes," urging full-time refs to curb the chaos.
newsbreak.com
Bucs coach Todd Bowles seethed, calling it "unacceptable," while Lions fans reveled in the 6-1 surge, Jahmyr Gibbs' 22-mph scorcher stealing headlines amid the whistle woes.McAfee's sarcasm underscores a season-long officiating crisis, where conspiracy whispers grow louder than cheers. As Tampa licks wounds without Mike Evans, the NFL's black-and-white stripes look grayer than ever.

[Bootz]

Very sad that this board believes the only reason the Bucs ever lose games is because of some conspiracy with the officials wanting the other team to win.

[Grahamburn]

Very sad that this board believes the only reason the Bucs ever lose games is because of some conspiracy with the officials wanting the other team to win.

It’s rampant.

That being said it also unfortunately seems to work? It did for the Lions. The Bucs got their asses kicked but anything gray seemed to go in Detroit’s favor.

The refs are human. They have tendencies and bias. You see it across individual drives. Games. Seasons.

[mdb1958]

I find it odd that different locations get better camera angles and time spent on disputed plays. You got the long drawn out looked at plays, you got the quick get the next play off plays, and then there are the it's no big deal plays that just get brushed off with very little fanfare.

[Pirate Life]

Pat McAfee is a Bucs fan and poster here? Nifty.

[mdb1958]

Will we ever get to jump into the Salvation Army bucket?

[GreatTimes]

Very sad that this board believes the only reason the Bucs ever lose games is because of some conspiracy with the officials wanting the other team to win.

Every team that lost, lost the game because of calls by the refs! (sarcasm)

[mdb1958]

NFL New York has swayism, and they own the puppets on the field, and the announcers are read in.

[mdb1958]

White could have had that Gibb's run called back with a finger snap and a holding call.

[mdb1958]

There is so much power in what's called and what's not called. NFL New York really loves calling the fouls on the defensive backfield players to extend drives.

[Central_Buc]

Listening to Scott Renyolds of PR, idk what you guys think but he feels that Barton should move to guard but that the team is fixated on keeping him at center.

I understand his argument which is he has been underwhelming this year at C. Played his best at LT at the start of the season, got dominated this passed Monday and Vita Vea at training camp.

I am of the camp of letting him work through it.

[Bootz]

Pat McAfee is a Bucs fan and poster here? Nifty.

He's been a huge Bucs supporter this year. Has Arians on his show in a regular guest spot just to talk Bucs.

[Jonny]

Listening to Scott Renyolds of PR, idk what you guys think but he feels that Barton should move to guard but that the team is fixated on keeping him at center.

I understand his argument which is he has been underwhelming this year at C. Played his best at LT at the start of the season, got dominated this passed Monday and Vita Vea at training camp.

I am of the camp of letting him work through it.

I was with SR and MM until Matt said Barton played great at LT. Not sure what games they watched. He was awful. The expectation were low and we were are forgiving.

[Bootz]

No one is gonna admit that 23 games in Barton has not done well at the NFL level. But he hasn't. He'll get the time to turn it around. And he needs to. Big time.

[BucsNBills]

Move him to guard and draft an actual center. Two positions likely get upgraded with one move.

[Grahamburn]

We complain when we move them around. We complain when we don’t move them around.

You know what would actually help? Having Mauch and Goedeke.

These same players were great last year. All of us know continuity (and great players) is what makes for a dominant o-line.

Shuffling guys and trading out one practice squad guy for another isn’t a fix. It’s putting a band aid over a bullet hole.

We’re not going to face Hutch every week. Maybe Goedeke is back if we play them again.

We’re 5-2. Both of our Super Bowl teams got their asses handed to them once or twice in the regular season. It happens.

[__Chef__]

... Both of our Super Bowl teams got their asses handed to them once or twice in the regular season. It happens.

Funny, I completely forgot about the 2020 New Orleans 3-38 stomping.

[Central_Buc]

Pat McAfee is a Bucs fan and poster here? Nifty.

How bout those refs, out to get the Bucs huh? What were they wearing, Lions pins or something

[Doctor]

And to think people wanted to let Bredeson go.

[Grahamburn]

... Both of our Super Bowl teams got their asses handed to them once or twice in the regular season. It happens.

Funny, I completely forgot about the 2020 New Orleans 3-38 stomping.

And got boat raced by the Chiefs.

[__Chef__]

Funny, I completely forgot about the 2020 New Orleans 3-38 stomping.

And got boat raced by the Chiefs.

Yes, but the 2nd half that was a different game. Brady almost completed another epic comeback.

[Grahamburn]

And to think people wanted to let Bredeson go.

We just released Sua Opeta back on 10/7. He just re-signed to the Eagles’ practice squad yesterday.

Sign him to our active roster?

[Nobody]

There is some disproportionate, recency bias-infused, response to what happened Monday night regarding pass protection and offensive output. Some perspective:

* This offensive line has been absolutely castrated by injuries this year. They haven't just been castrated personnel-wise, they've also had the second order issue of being castrated via (a) continuity implications and (b) having to sort a deranged "best fit" in terms of personnel pairings (LT/LG, interior, RG/RT). That is a very big deal.

* Despite that first bullet point, the relevant offensive coaches had masterfully navigated this problem from Week 1 through Week 6. They moved people around and it mostly worked (not with respect to individual performances, but collectively in terms of protection). They deftly set up protection schemes and play-calling to consistently give extra help where extra help was needed (overwhelmingly that meant the interior and the right side).

* However, then we get the buzzsaw of Monday night. Recency; just happened. Frequency; 1 game in contrast with 6. Magnitude; significant in that we may have just lost very important playoff positioning (assuming we endure and sustain for the rest of the season). I understand the magnitude and the recency bit makes perspectives lose their effing mind. But we need to try to throttle it back a bit. That frequency piece has to be a big piece of the analysis. It can't be overwhelmed by recency and magnitude such that frequency suddenly ceases to exist as a confounder.

What happened Monday night was a masterclass in coaching for Detroit; position coaching across the board but especially DBs as well as gameplanning and play-calling. Further, they got health in key ways up front that really took advantage of our weaknesses up front (interior and right side OL). This allowed them gameplan specifically to (a) double team two players vs our limited eligibles (we're putting less people in routes to protect our interior and right side) while (b) having a low hole rover who has eyes on Baker and can run-and-chase in case he somehow escapes the quickly deteriorating pocket courtesy of those up-front guys.

And that Lions team is physical as hell (personality, culture, coaching, probably practice orthodoxy), rallies hats to the ball, and tackles. That is a real problem for a Screen game which might offset some of our present deficiencies.

A perfect storm of ass-whoop.

-------------------

Alright, that said. Couple negative thoughts or expressions of uncertainty:

* Elijah Klein not being ready to play RG despite our brutal deficiencies there is disconcerting. We have really good coaches on the OL, so a year 2 player not being able to step in and perform in our situation...that isn't a great indicator for his future prospects.

* Barton is a very athletic and capable movement player. He does great in space, when tasked with setting dynamically with his feet he does well. However, it isn't clear to me at this point that he is going to ascend to an upper echelon interior player where (a) things happen enormously quickly (cognitively and then physically) and (b) you're in a phone booth (where consistent play leverage + balance with immediacy and the ability to shoot hands powerfully + accurately or reset well if need be are all at an absolute premium). Collectively, we were a very good unit last year. Some of that was personnel. Some of that was brilliant play-calling, gameplanning, and coaching. Individually, Barton was sometimes ok, sometimes solid, sometimes good, sometimes poor. Net, the fullness of his play was uneven at Center, but he improved as the year wore on. This year he's been moved around and then there is a complete lack of continuity on the interior (which is essential generally for Center play but especially for someone still working at the intricacies of the position).

For now, Barton at Center is still an unknown quantity; more unformed clay than fire-hardened shape.

* Obvious train-wreck of getting away from the run by Grizzard. Can't happen again.

[Doctor]

Was about to bring up Klein as well. Disappointing he hasn't stepped up. I suppose you can't hit on everything, and hitting on a practice squad guy is just as good but we haven't really done that with this shuffle.

Barton to guard isn't crazy. Licht is on a crusade to find himself a HoF center. He believes it's the secret sauce to great OLs and maybe he's right. He tried with Ali. He's trying with Barton. Maybe moving Ben back to center where he wasn't bad and have Barton pulling as a guard wouldn't be the worse change. Don't see it happening, at least not any time soon, but it's not crazy. I worry Luke is going to keep missing a good number of weeks even after the bye. Barton at tackle isn't nuts either.

[Snake]

Getting scooped by Kansas City will always be the one that got away.

[Nobody]

Getting scooped by Kansas City will always be the one that got away.

100

Can you imagine the different trajectory of this franchise and shape of the NFL if we subbed in the best Center in the league (who is also durable…and at this point, availability is basically a superpower in the NFL) for this offense (and those post-SB seasons) and subbed out that same player for KC?

The shape of the league these last five years becomes different. One (seemingly innocuous to a lot of folks at the time) transaction. Bonkers.