Rapid Reactions: Buccaneers loss to the Panthers

[Dread]

Such a scapegoat attempt trying to put this on the coaching staff. This is literally the same staff minus 1 guy. And that 1 guy is still in the building.

This roster is worse than people will admit. They are playing worse than people will admit.

Other than Marpet and Jensen, this is largely the same roster though.

Lots of blame to go around, but any coach (and his staff) would be getting heat after losing a double digit favorite 2 weeks in a row.

[Xandtar]

Welcome back, Bucs of old.

It was a great couple of years while you were away.

Sigh.

[King Bootz]

Such a scapegoat attempt trying to put this on the coaching staff. This is literally the same staff minus 1 guy. And that 1 guy is still in the building.

This roster is worse than people will admit. They are playing worse than people will admit.

Other than Marpet and Jensen, this is largely the same roster though.

And Gronk. And AB. And Whitehead. And Suh. And JPP. And Cappa. And Rojo.

[Sdbucs]

I really do think that we need to make a move to bring in somebody on the O-line.

That might be wishful, madden thinking, but our O-line is really hindering us.

We can win with this roster so I'm completely for giving up draft capital

[nybf]

[Backside]

Defensive head coach..

[Max]

For everyone who thinks Turds is doing a better job than Turdwich right now.

For comparison, Brady had one game with a 90+ PFF grade last year. In a season that should've won him MVP.

This team is historically underperforming on both sides of the ball.

[King Bootz]

Isn't that a big no-no?

[Dread]

I really do think that we need to make a move to bring in somebody on the O-line.

That might be wishful, madden thinking, but our O-line is really hindering us.

We can win with this roster so I'm completely for giving up draft capital

Chances are nobody of substance is available.

It's not surprising to see growing pains on the Oline considering the turnover there, but not to this level. That said, this new Oline was always likely to be better at the end of the year then they were in the first half of the season, which is true of most Olines.

It's just really surprising how shockingly bad the rushing offense has been.

[King Bootz]

For everyone who thinks Turds is doing a better job than Turdwich right now.

For comparison, Brady had one game with a 90+ PFF grade last year. In a season that should've won him MVP.

This team is historically underperforming on both sides of the ball.

Shouldn't Tom Brady, greatest QB of all time, be out performing P.J. Walker?

[Max]

For everyone who thinks Turds is doing a better job than Turdwich right now.

For comparison, Brady had one game with a 90+ PFF grade last year. In a season that should've won him MVP.

This team is historically underperforming on both sides of the ball.

Shouldn't Tom Brady, greatest QB of all time, be out performing P.J. Walker?

Could you repeat the question?

I don't speak retard

[Snake]

Shouldn't Tom Brady, greatest QB of all time, be out performing P.J. Walker?

Could you repeat the question?

I don't speak retard

[McFan]

As much as I like Bowles as a DC, he's not head coaching material. They play and look flat. Seems like his Jets teams were like that too.

To quote Marisa Tomei in the movie "My Cousin Vinny"..... THEY WAS!!!

[McFan]

Could you repeat the question?
I don't speak retard

(whispering to Max) .... I think its "special needs"

[BucsNBills]

Defensive head coach..

Not sure how that's possible with this Lockdown defense....

[King Bootz]

Shouldn't Tom Brady, greatest QB of all time, be out performing P.J. Walker?

Could you repeat the question?

I don't speak retard

You sure speak bull shit though. I mean why else would you say "turd" twice in the same post?

[The Outsider]

I used Ronaldo (e and o are nowhere close to each other on the qwerty keyboard) as an example because in prior posts you made some pretty absurd statements regarding athletes not quitting because of competitive nature, etc. So I provided you with an example of possibly the most competitive spirited, chip-on-his-shoulder-having athlete in the world quitting on his team this season.

As for players just leaving the team, well see in the real world you can leave a job and immediately go work if hired somewhere else, even in the same industry.

In the NFL, athletics in general really, and honestly most contract positions that isn't typically the case. They can't just walk off the team and go get signed next week. They're under contract, a contract which gives the Buccaneers as an organization the rights to them as a player in the NFL for the duration of said contract. So if they're under contract and they're showing up to what they need to show up to and putting in the minimum effort why shouldn't they collect their checks? They literally can't go elsewhere.

Why would they go out there and prove themselves to be a detriment to the team instead of walking away? If you quit, then quit. Don't take everyone else down with you.

You're backing off your Ronaldo example because it no longer fits, so I have another one for you. Vontae Davis. Quit at halftime because he didn't like the direction. Antonio Brown, we all know what happened there. Don't quit in secret like a coward and take the field. The quitters need to be called out. You tell me who they are.

As for the bolded: lol what fantasy world do you live in? For the rest: I backed off of nothing. You're obtuseness forced me to explain why I used the comparison I did because you clearly didn't understand the purpose.

And the quitters? Virtually the entire offense. Mike Evans literally said it in his press conference. After his drop he saw the life go out of the entire offense. That's who quit, and when, and why, and one of them even said it out loud.

[King Bootz]

Why would they go out there and prove themselves to be a detriment to the team instead of walking away? If you quit, then quit. Don't take everyone else down with you.

You're backing off your Ronaldo example because it no longer fits, so I have another one for you. Vontae Davis. Quit at halftime because he didn't like the direction. Antonio Brown, we all know what happened there. Don't quit in secret like a coward and take the field. The quitters need to be called out. You tell me who they are.

As for the bolded: lol what fantasy world do you live in? For the rest: I backed off of nothing. You're obtuseness forced me to explain why I used the comparison I did because you clearly didn't understand the purpose.

And the quitters? Virtually the entire offense. Mike Evans literally said it in his press conference. After his drop he saw the life go out of the entire offense. That's who quit, and when, and why, and one of them even said it out loud.

And you want to keep quitters around?

[The Outsider]

As for the bolded: lol what fantasy world do you live in? For the rest: I backed off of nothing. You're obtuseness forced me to explain why I used the comparison I did because you clearly didn't understand the purpose.

And the quitters? Virtually the entire offense. Mike Evans literally said it in his press conference. After his drop he saw the life go out of the entire offense. That's who quit, and when, and why, and one of them even said it out loud.

And you want to keep quitters around?

Sure, depending on talent level and context. Morale can be improved, metaphorical fires can be lit under metaphorical asses.

How can that be done?

I'm not entirely sure because I'm not in the room so I don't know exactly what the issues are that are at the heart of the offense in particular having morale low enough that they quit on a game after one bad play.

[King Bootz]

And you want to keep quitters around?

Sure, depending on talent level and context. Morale can be improved, metaphorical fires can be lit under metaphorical asses.

How can that be done?

I'm not entirely sure because I'm not in the room so I don't know exactly what the issues are that are at the heart of the offense in particular having morale low enough that they quit on a game after one bad play.

Talent means absolutely nothing if you've proven that you would rather quit than be part of the solution. Quitting is the easy way out. So according to you, instead of guys who can actually turn it around, we might as well be done because we have guys who are quitters doing nothing but collecting checks.

And that 1 play had ZERO to do with coaching or playcalling.

What's blatantly obvious is the lack of accountability. A drop on the 3rd play of the game and the response is to curl up and check out? Get those guys out.

[Snake]

Bootz, what do you think is the problem with this team? And what, if anything, can be done to address it by those in the org?

[nybf]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... ike-evans/

[Snake]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... ike-evans/

Just what we needed. Lmao

[Dread]

What's blatantly obvious is the lack of accountability.

I agree. But who is most responsible for ensuring there is a culture of accountability? Most would say leadership.

Nobody is arguing that the players aren't also to blame for the sad display of football through 7 games (especially on offense). But there is no way this roster should've lost either of these past 2 games, much less both.

When a collective unit is vastly underperforming over and over again, which the Bucs are, it's leadership that gets held accountable. That's how it works in business, the military, or just about any enterprise you come across.

I'm not sure why you feel Bowles or Lunchbox shouldn't be included in the blame for this shitshow. Are you interpreting this thread as people arguing it's only the coaches fault?

[Dread]

Sure, depending on talent level and context. Morale can be improved, metaphorical fires can be lit under metaphorical asses.

How can that be done?

I'm not entirely sure because I'm not in the room so I don't know exactly what the issues are that are at the heart of the offense in particular having morale low enough that they quit on a game after one bad play.

Talent means absolutely nothing if you've proven that you would rather quit than be part of the solution. Quitting is the easy way out. So according to you, instead of guys who can actually turn it around, we might as well be done because we have guys who are quitters doing nothing but collecting checks.

And that 1 play had ZERO to do with coaching or playcalling.

What's blatantly obvious is the lack of accountability. A drop on the 3rd play of the game and the response is to curl up and check out? Get those guys out.

Yeah, let's get rid of Mike Evans. He's a BUM!

/blue

[Digital_Damage]

I no longer see Bootz post... however, I suspect it is a bunch of bullshit saying it is not our coach's fault ( I wonder why...)

I will say this, even with our departures and injuries this team should not lose to a 1-5 team actively tanking. The fact that we did 3-21 is 100% a coaching issue. They have lost the team. FULL STOP.

It would be a different conversation if we lost to .500 team, even with all our issues this team has a better roster than the Panthers and they blew us out.

[Snake]

Bowles detects staleness in the clubhouse. It’s why he said players are still coasting on the SB win.

Who is to blame for that?

Him, and the team captains.

Maybe there isn’t enough new blood. Maybe Brady’s negativity has permeated the whole team. Maybe Bowles dry approach is to blame.

Probably a bit of everything.

[King Bootz]

Bootz, what do you think is the problem with this team? And what, if anything, can be done to address it by those in the org?

Simple. Players need to play better. You can't have 2 interior linemen leading the league in pressures and expect things to operate as normal. You can't have receivers dropping passes and expect things to be just fine. You can't have a QB missing reads, throw passes inaccurately. Can't have your starting RB continue to misdiagnosis blocks and run into the back of linemen.

Now you were right, that a lot of this falls on Jason Licht for having his plan to replace Ali Marpet come in the form of a TE turned RT turned LG. You were right that he should have done more to address the Oline. And we're seeing the result of that now.

But now we're supposed to think that the same coaches that have been here for 4 years now with the same system suddenly don't know how to do their jobs? That is a sad excuse. Now we're at a point where fans are saying it's just fine that players quit because as a grown ass man they aren't motivated enough to do the job they get paid millions to do. That is such a loser mentality that plagued this franchise for decades.

How do we address it? Idk, maybe the players should take the onus on themselves work on their craft more. Attention to detail. Most everyone knows this system already. What's changed is pisspoor play on the field and a drop in talent. The defense is doing their part. The offense needs to play better.

[King Bootz]

Talent means absolutely nothing if you've proven that you would rather quit than be part of the solution. Quitting is the easy way out. So according to you, instead of guys who can actually turn it around, we might as well be done because we have guys who are quitters doing nothing but collecting checks.

And that 1 play had ZERO to do with coaching or playcalling.

What's blatantly obvious is the lack of accountability. A drop on the 3rd play of the game and the response is to curl up and check out? Get those guys out.

Yeah, let's get rid of Mike Evans. He's a BUM!

/blue

So if Evans admitted he quit on the team because of his drop, you're okay with that?

[Digital_Damage]

Bowles detects staleness in the clubhouse. It’s why he said players are still coasting on the SB win.

Who is to blame for that?

Him, and the team captains.

Maybe there isn’t enough new blood. Maybe Brady’s negativity has permeated the whole team. Maybe Bowles dry approach is to blame.

Probably a bit of everything.

My suspicion is many of these players know this team is not going to win another Superbowl with this coaching staff. It seems like they are all going into self-preservation mode to pick up contracts next season with another team.

Smells like the Kiffin fiasco all over again.

[King Bootz]

What's blatantly obvious is the lack of accountability.

I agree. But who is most responsible for ensuring there is a culture of accountability? Most would say leadership.

Nobody is arguing that the players aren't also to blame for the sad display of football through 7 games (especially on offense). But there is no way this roster should've lost either of these past 2 games, much less both.

When a collective unit is vastly underperforming over and over again, which the Bucs are, it's leadership that gets held accountable. That's how it works in business, the military, or just about any enterprise you come across.

I'm not sure why you feel Bowles or Lunchbox shouldn't be included in the blame for this shitshow. Are you interpreting this thread as people arguing it's only the coaches fault?

I'm interpreting this thread the way it is: broad, vague statements like "it's playcalling" but people who can't tell you what was called or the concept of a specific play. I ask this question every time someone bitches about play calling "What play should they have called" and it never gets answered because people know they are simply talking out their ass.

What's funny is weren't people saying a few weeks ago that Brady said to hell with Leftwich and started calling his own offense? Was that a lie or is it not happening anymore? I mean what happened there?

Does Bowles and Co take some blame. Yes. Do the players? Yes. Jason Licht, big yep and in my mind he might take the biggest share of everyone.

[King Bootz]

Bowles detects staleness in the clubhouse. It’s why he said players are still coasting on the SB win.

Who is to blame for that?

Him, and the team captains.

Maybe there isn’t enough new blood. Maybe Brady’s negativity has permeated the whole team. Maybe Bowles dry approach is to blame.

Probably a bit of everything.

I can buy this. That entire "we're bringing the gang back" thing was good for the history books, but bad in the sense that we took sentiment over improvement. Bowles wasn't HC at the time, but the Bucs FO was basically still coasting off of the SB as well.

[Snake]

To use the Parcells analogy:

Licht buys the ingredients. Bowles does the cooking.

If you know you’re gonna get dry chicken every week (Goedeke/Hainsey), you should probably change up your approach with how you feature or implement the chicken. The dry chicken isn’t gonna miraculously become moist and great. No matter how many times you yell at it or give it a motivational speech.

[King Bootz]

To use the Parcells analogy:

Licht buys the ingredients. Bowles does the cooking.

If you know you’re gonna get dry chicken every week (Goedeke/Hainsey), you should probably change up your approach with how you feature or implement the chicken. The dry chicken isn’t gonna miraculously become moist and great. No matter how many times you yell at it or give it a motivational speech.

Kinda night and day from....

Licht fucked up. Signing WRs Instead of bolstering oline. Going with low hanging fruit for his HC.

It’ll be his undoing.

[Snake]

Again, I assess blame to all parties. Shit travels uphill. When the owner of the restaurant gets tired of reading negative reviews about poor quality ingredients, the GM should get fired first and then he can decide if the chef stinks or had limited tools.

I think Licht has possibly run his course. I also think Bowles probably isn’t a great coach. I’d be okay with a fresh start after the season.